Pair Of Goodwin & Co Old Judge "Proof" Photos - Knowledge Wanted

[bbitt]

Hello,

I recently acquired these Goodwin & Co 1888 "proof" photos of Old Judge cards. The one on the left is backwards and of Burns, center fielder (Jim?). The team name is Omaha. The photo on the right is written on back, Boyce or Boyle, also #0133 and Washington something, Clap? I am attempting to gather any more info about the photos and the players before selling them. I would love to hear your opinion, and especially get a sense on value. Thanks in advance!

Brian Bittner

[bmarlowe1]

The one on the left is James Burns - it may be the missing image on page 166 of "The Photographic Baseball Cards...."

[slidekellyslide]

I think the proofs have been attributed to the early 1900s and not actually period to the issue of the Old Judge cards. There were a lot of Omaha poses that surfaced with the "proof" find.

[drc]

There was a find similar Old Judged 'proofs'. It's generally believed they were made in the early 1900s, say circa 1910. There was photography studio envelope with the find, and the studio name and address was used to give a date. The images on these photos are very sharp and clear, as they were made from the original negatives. A bunch were sold about a few years ago in a REA auction, with REA correctly dating them as early 1900s, and they received bids roughly about $800-$1,000 each. That's a rough estimate, as some were framed with multiple photos on one mount. REA dated them as being from the 1902-1910s range.

[bbitt]

http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/...2008/1167.html

Here is the link to the other, similar, set of proofs previously noted. If the James Burns photo is indeed the missing image what should I ask for mine? Or, am I better off selling it with REA or Goodwin? Also note, these are not matted on the thick cardboard as the others are.

[Joe_G.]

They are in fact James Burns (presumably a reversed image of pose 56-7) and Abner Boyce (33-3). They certainly date to well after the ATC (American Tobacco Company) formation (1890), likely early 20th century. I'm aware of two different glass plate negatives of James Burns, pose 8 and a yet to be catalogued pose 10 (that will never be catalogued unless an N172 or N173 of said image is found). A surprising number of the remaining glass plate negatives and photos developed from long lost negatives are not catalogued.

Hard to assign a value to your examples, but I suspect an actual N172 of 56-7 (a missing image in the book) would bring more money than the above example.

Good luck with them.

[bbitt]

Interesting, thanks! I am waiting to hear back from REA about their estimates. I do need to sell these in hopes of buying more. Do i hear any offers?

[Hal Kaplan]

The back of the Washington player says "Boyce" and "Washington Club", but the "b" in "Club" is cut off.

[drc]

I have seen some of these 'proofs' in person, and they had the same kind of alligator skin surface to the images as yours. It's something I never noticed until I looked at one up close and in person, but your close up shows it.

[jbsports33]

Brain,

REA is a good resource for your proofs, that is were I got the estimates for you photos from their ending auctions –research is key with these because many photos surfaced that were not originally from the 1880s, but from the 1900s as stated above by member drc and reprint types have been found.

good luck

Jimmy