I got screwed over on the BST today!

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

I tested this theory one time, in one auction, and threw in a couple of what I considered to be fairly low max bids on the last day. Surprisingly, I actually won both of the cards I had bid on, both below the max bid price, one at a really good price. That doesn't mean that I wasn't shilled by any means, but I will say that I was really surprised by how little I ended up paying for cards. I view it as somewhat of an interesting character study about how greed and fraud works when the feds have you and are far up your ass.

Doug continued to commit fraud while at Legendary.

[Kenny Cole]

It was a Legendary auction I was talking about. I think it may have been the last one, actually. He was also under indictment by then.

[ksabet]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Another thing that makes you an idiot is that you don't know when to shut up. I gave you the last word in post #183. That wasn't good enough for you, you had to start in again in post #188. 4+ hours of no response wasn't good enough for you? Ok, so once again, I'll give you the last word. Go ahead and say whatever you want to say so we can move on and I promise not to respond. You can have the last word once again.

I agree my parents also taught me to be honorable and have a high grade of moral character. This included not backing out of deals...and...being kind to others, staying positive all the time and doing my best to always treat everyone better than I would hope to be treated.

I would hope your parents didn't skip over that second part

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

It was a Legendary auction I was talking about. I think it may have been the last one, actually. He was also under indictment by then.

Doug's crimes while he was under indictment dwarf what he did at Mastro.

[Kenny Cole]

You would know far better than I do. That would make him far more arrogant and stupid than I ever gave him credit for being.

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by packs

I'm still not really seeing the outrage. I get it that it's annoying that you thought you bought a card, but the real anger lies in selling your card and not being able to get it back on the other end of the deal.

Everyone was squared away when it was cancelled. There isn't a lingering refund problem or a lost card in the mail. I think it's reasonable to think twice about dealing with a seller, but I don't see why he should have to do something with his card he doesn't want to do (even though I realize no one forced him to put it up for sale).

I can't believe how ridiculous this response is. The problem is that after a transaction was completed (i.e. payment made) that the buyer then proceeded to create a subsequent transaction that could not be reversed.

Let's see if this helps, packs.

1) You buy a plane ticket to Hawaii for a week's vacation. You then purchase a hotel room and several day trips. At the last minute the flight decides to cancel because it isn't full enough. You don't get a refund for the hotel and day trips.

2) You get a new job at a Fortune 500 company. You respectfully put in 2 week's notice at your old job. The new job decides they want someone else. Your "old" company doesn't want you back.

3) Your son gets accepted to the State University. He then rejects his other offers. In late summer the State University decides they have too many students and cancels his acceptance.

4) Your daughter books a spectacular site for her wedding reception a couple years in advance. Everyone fly's in for the event, flowers and catering are paid for and ready, but the day before the wedding the site owner decides he would rather catch up on some sleep and not bother with allowing use of his property.

In each example the seller gave a full refund and wasn't "forced" to complete the transaction. So you actually blame the buyer for making plans before the transaction was complete?

[jbhofmann]

Originally Posted by egbeachley

I can't believe how ridiculous this response is. The problem is that after a transaction was completed (i.e. payment made) that the buyer then proceeded to create a subsequent transaction that could not be reversed.

Let's see if this helps, packs.

1) You buy a plane ticket to Hawaii for a week's vacation. You then purchase a hotel room and several day trips. At the last minute the flight decides to cancel because it isn't full enough. You don't get a refund for the hotel and day trips.

2) You get a new job at a Fortune 500 company. You respectfully put in 2 week's notice at your old job. The new job decides they want someone else. Your "old" company doesn't want you back.

3) Your son gets accepted to the State University. He then rejects his other offers. In late summer the State University decides they have too many students and cancels his acceptance.

4) Your daughter books a spectacular site for her wedding reception a couple years in advance. Everyone fly's in for the event, flowers and catering are paid for and ready, but the day before the wedding the site owner decides he would rather catch up on some sleep and not bother with allowing use of his property.

In each example the seller gave a full refund and wasn't "forced" to complete the transaction. So you actually blame the buyer for making plans before the transaction was complete?

DISCLAIMER-- I agree that the deal should have 100% went through and feel for the buyer.


I need a new driver.

I sell my old driver that is too stiff of a shaft for my declining swing speed after hearing my buddy say he'll sell me his extra.

Buddy says he actually is going to keep his driver because he just shot a 75 during our round.

I go to any number of stores and buy a new driver.


These silly examples can be played either way. While a '51 Mantle isn't a stock Callaway Big Bertha, it's not a black market Rembrandt either.

[EvilKing00]

You put your card up for sale, you agree to a price you receive payment ...you sell the card.

UNLESS you had explained you were upgrading and the card was contingent on another deal. I sell a lot of homes (not that this is the same) and deals die all the time causing a similar chain reaction BUT they die on being contingent on a mortgage or the sale or their current home. If they aren't contingent per the contract they all go through. unless one of the parties dies . which actually happened to me once. That's my opinion for what its worth.

[Shoeless Moe]

have not thought of this amazes me, let Newman decide:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsbgwNe4Rv4


split the card in half! And you each get a piece.

[egri]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

have not thought of this amazes me, let Newman decide:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsbgwNe4Rv4


split the card in half! And you each get a piece.

The hamburger way or the hotdog way?

[timn1]

Yes, David, it's not your particular opinion that is the issue here- I agree that he should have gone through with the deal. It's your tendency to insult people for no good reason when your views could be made perfectly clear without doing so.

Originally Posted by packs

You're problem is that you frame things in a way that you think skews to your perspective. The issue here is you insulting me for no reason at all. As has been demonstrated by everyone else in this thread, it is possible to express your opinions without insulting people. So once again, so you're clear on why what you're doing is lame and inexcusable, its not cool to insult people who disagree with your trivial opinions. Its even less cool to hide behind polemics instead of just acknowledging your behavior.

[PolarBear]

Crappy centering, roller mark. I think he did you a favor backing out. They're common enough that you can find a much better one.

[rocarroll]

Staying positive all the time? Really? You are quite the unique individual I must say.

Originally Posted by ksabet

...staying positive all the time and doing my best to always treat everyone better than I would hope to be treated.

I would hope your parents didn't skip over that second part

[Exhibitman]

You only have one hobby reputation and an honorable collector and gentleman honors his deals (and his gambling debts), even when it is not convenient. It may be caveat emptor, it may be something that no one is going to run out and sue over, but that's irrelevant. Is it really worth your hobby rep to renege on a friggin' card deal?

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by travrosty

the snakebelly/wagon wheel rut option.

Is that the one where we go a-ridin' into town, a-whompin' and a-whumpin' every livin' thing that moves within an inch of its life?

[pokerplyr80]

I don't get why Dan just didn't honor the deal in the first place. Even though his deal fell through, obviously his plan was to sell this Mantle and upgrade (or down grade) to a different one. He sold it for what he felt was a fair price and already had the funds transferred.

Personally, I would have completed the transaction and used the money to find the Mantle I was looking for. Who cares if your collection is without a Mantle rookie for few days or weeks. I think looking back, Dan will realize it wasn't worth ruining his reputation on this board over this card.

[trdcrdkid]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Is that the one where we go a-ridin' into town, a-whompin' and a-whumpin' every livin' thing that moves within an inch of its life?

+1 for the Blazing Saddles reference.

[dealme]

Originally Posted by trdcrdkid

+1 for the Blazing Saddles reference.

Agreed, but he's confused the snakebelly / wagonwheel rut option with the Ol' Number 6

[ksabet]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

Staying positive all the time? Really? You are quite the unique individual I must say.

Didn't say I was successful all the time . Just that that was how my parents tried to raise me.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by dealme

Agreed, but he's confused the snakebelly / wagonwheel rut option with the Ol' Number 6

Number 6? I'm not familiar with that one.

[Koufax32fan]

Taggart: I got it! I got it!
Hedley Lamarr: You do?
Taggart: We'll work up a Number 6 on 'em.
Hedley Lamarr: [frowns] "Number 6"? I'm afraid I'm not familiar with that one.
Taggart: Well, that's where we go a-ridin' into town, a-whompin' and a-whumpin' every livin' thing that moves within an inch of its life. Except the women folks, of course.
Hedley Lamarr: You spare the women?
Taggart: Naw, we rape the shit out of them at the Number Six Dance later on.
Hedley Lamarr: Marvelous!

[ALR-bishop]

Well at least it is someone besides Eric getting 6'd in that scenario

[Deertick]

Originally Posted by Koufax32fan

Taggart: I got it! I got it!
Hedley Lamarr: You do?
Taggart: We'll work up a Number 6 on 'em.
Hedley Lamarr: [frowns] "Number 6"? I'm afraid I'm not familiar with that one.
Taggart: Well, that's where we go a-ridin' into town, a-whompin' and a-whumpin' every livin' thing that moves within an inch of its life. Except the women folks, of course.
Hedley Lamarr: You spare the women?
Taggart: Naw, we rape the shit out of them at the Number Six Dance later on.
Hedley Lamarr: Marvelous!

I have a road nearby named Rockridge. Every time I get on it, regardless if I am alone or not, I yell "Somebody go back and get a shitload of dimes!"

[cozmokramer]

Not the best card, but fills the hole for now until I can upgrade... The price was right too!

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1443828067.392130.jpg

[cozmokramer]

And it's centered well!

[4815162342]

You were seriously jonesin' for a '51 Mantle!

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Gobucsmagic74

I'm not asking for anyone's sympathy or support on this one and furthermore understand Eric's frustration and those who feel my decision is/was dishonorable, but at the end of the day the card is mine to do with what I choose.

I don't normally get involved in stuff like that, but in the deal Luke referenced where you offered to sell him a card, I'll clear that up.

I agreed to sell you a card. You offered it for sell to Luke prior to my receiving payment or your receiving the card. What if Luke had agreed to your offer to sell my card to him and had sent you the money, and then I had 'pulled a Dan' and reneged on our deal? What you just did seems much worse than what I considered doing (but didn't), given that not only did you make the deal this time - you actually had the money in hand.

You have now played both sides and claimed that both are ethical. If everyone on the board did business like this, we would have no classified section.

edited for spelling - Whoops

Originally Posted by Runscott

I don't normally get involved in stuff like that, but in the deal Luke referenced where you offered to sell him a card, I'll clear that up.

I agreed to sell you a card. You offered it for sell to Luke prior to my receiving payment or your receiving the card. What if Luke had agreed to your offer to sell my card to him and had sent you the money, and then I had 'pulled a Dan' and reneged on our deal? What you just did seems much worse than what I considered doing (but didn't), given that not only did you make the deal this time - you actually had the money in hand.

You have now played both sides and claimed that both are ethical. If everyone on the board did business like this, we would have no classified section.

edited for spelling - Whoops

In your scenario I would have refunded Luke's money. Pretty simple. As far as the deal with Eric, I made a decision and accept the consequences of it.

[Secondbase]

Screwed?......No

I wish you luck in finding another but you did not win a auction. Seller has every right to back out. Good luck.

[Sean1125]

Originally Posted by Secondbase

Screwed?......No

I wish you luck in finding another but you did it win a auction. Seller has every right to back out. Good luck.

English, please?

[cozmokramer]

Originally Posted by Secondbase

Screwed?......No



I wish you luck in finding another but you did it win a auction. Seller has every right to back out. Good luck.

Seller has every right to back out? Even after they've collected all the money from the buyer?

In this scenario then, how long can the seller KEEP both the card and he buyers money before deciding if he's going to sell?

[shammus]

Originally Posted by Secondbase

Screwed?......No

I wish you luck in finding another but you did not win a auction. Seller has every right to back out. Good luck.

I see this is your first post, so since you're obviously not known to the board or any of it's members, per forum rules we're going to need your first and last name next to each post you make on controversial threads such as this one. No one is allowed to remain anonymous when participating in threads such as this. Thanks and nothing personal...

[iwantitiwinit]

Originally Posted by Secondbase

Screwed?......No

I wish you luck in finding another but you did not win a auction. Seller has every right to back out. Good luck.

Actually, he has no right whatsoever to back out.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Secondbase

Screwed?......No
I wish you luck in finding another but you did not win a auction. Seller has every right to back out. Good luck.

You are now honored by having the fewest posts ever for being banned from our BST. You won't get the chance to back out of a deal here. While a first offense won't usually get you banned it is NOT an "acceptable" action in general.. good luck

and per rules, as Brian mentioned, the name our new member gave for registration is suspect (to me) .... Chr.is toph.er....and in looking at his id and "full" name we are going to go ahead and suspend him completely until he and I have a chat. I am going to go out on a limb and think his full name isn't Chris topher........if it is then my bad .....we'll see. We don't allow complete anonymity on this board, registrations have to be correct.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Secondbase didn't make it past first.

[bobbyw8469]

#sellingcardsmatters

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Secondbase didn't make it past first.

Now that's funny

[Paul S]

Maybe he has a mononym? Like Kreskin or Zorro?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Paul S

Maybe he has a mononym? Like Kreskin or Zorro?

Geat, when he convinces us he can come back....

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by Leon

You are now honored by having the fewest posts ever for being banned from our BST. You won't get the chance to back out of a deal here. While a first offense won't usually get you banned it is NOT an "acceptable" action in general.. good luck

and per rules, as Brian mentioned, the name our new member gave for registration is suspect (to me) .... Chr.is toph.er....and in looking at his id and "full" name we are going to go ahead and suspend him completely until he and I have a chat. I am going to go out on a limb and think his full name isn't Chris topher........if it is then my bad .....we'll see. We don't allow complete anonymity on this board, registrations have to be correct.

I am impressed by the quick and decisive action taken by Leon in this case and agree that we do not need members on this board who feel it's ok to back out of a transaction, especially one where thousands of dollars have already changed hands.

Another reason why I'm a big fan of this board.

[dclarkraiders]

+1. Well said.

Duane Clark

[dclarkraiders]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I am impressed by the quick and decisive action taken by Leon in this case and agree that we do not need members on this board who feel it's ok to back out of a transaction, especially one where thousands of dollars have already changed hands.

Another reason why I'm a big fan of this board.

+1. Well said

Duane Clark

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Gobucsmagic74

In your scenario I would have refunded Luke's money. Pretty simple. As far as the deal with Eric, I made a decision and accept the consequences of it.

I just wanted to clear up what happened. The consequences of your behavior are not something I'm concerned about.

[Bpm0014]

Agree. Kudos to Leon for taking quick, decisive action in trying to keep this forum free from scammers and scum bags.

[cozmokramer]

Awesome update as if 10/11... Yeah!

My friend ran into an unforeseen circumstance and he presented my with the opportunity to be able to buy back my PSA 2mc Mantle card from him.

So I'm back to where I was before all this hoopla started.

Now holding a PSA 1 and PSA 2mc Mantle as a result of all this, it's time to start all over and figure out how to turn those two into an upgrade.... Probably a PSA 4 is what I'll look for!

[Luke]

.

[pawpawdiv9]

Originally Posted by cozmokramer

Awesome update as if 10/11... Yeah!

My friend ran into an unforeseen circumstance and he presented my with the opportunity to be able to buy back my PSA 2mc Mantle card from him.

So I'm back to where I was before all this hoopla started.

Now holding a PSA 1 and PSA 2mc Mantle as a result of all this, it's time to start all over and figure out how to turn those two into an upgrade.... Probably a PSA 4 is what I'll look for!

What a dilema, having 2 52 #311 Mick rookies.
I love mine, and glad i got it before the 'boom' , on the bay, 2's are asking 14-16k and upwards to 21k for a 2.5 centered well. However i ran across a 2.5 affordable & centered one around or near 13k, and looks presentable ending today that be a good looker or is it hooker.
BTW- show us both your Micks, us post-war guys love to see them.

[cozmokramer]

They are 51 bowman, not 52 topps.

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1444591290.872519.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1444591298.139585.jpg

[pawpawdiv9]

Sorry bro, i been stuck on 52's all day, Nice pics btw. Still nice to have 2 of them 51's.
I can see where you want a more presentable one or one without the crease thru the player. You should go for the upgrade. Mine is a BVG 2 and centered nice, love the more affordable grades that look well. The 51 is a undervalued card compared to his 52.

Originally Posted by cozmokramer

Awesome update as if 10/11... Yeah!

My friend ran into an unforeseen circumstance and he presented my with the opportunity to be able to buy back my PSA 2mc Mantle card from him.

So I'm back to where I was before all this hoopla started.

Now holding a PSA 1 and PSA 2mc Mantle as a result of all this, it's time to start all over and figure out how to turn those two into an upgrade.... Probably a PSA 4 is what I'll look for!

Interesting how you immediately pulled the listing for the PSA 2 (MC) on Friday as soon as I asked you if it was the same one you claimed to have sold to a friend for a loss in the opening post of this thread.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1951-Bowman-...:X:AAQ:US:1123

Equally interesting that you posted this status update after I told you I was trying to decide whether or not to share the knowledge of this with the board.