Former PSA employee AMA on reddit

[obiwan1129]

Not sure if anyone else saw this, but it caught my eye. I don't know if they are still actively answering questions on the thread but it is worth a look.

https://www.reddit.com/r/baseballcar...k_me_anything/

[swarmee]

Interesting; they've only answered a couple of the questions, so I have to think it's still ongoing. Looks like they've laid off a large number of workers in the shipping department due to their cancellation of the lower service levels.

[bobbyw8469]

So is that where my missing package went???

[Rhotchkiss]

Its noteworthy that the guy states that every card is reviewed by at least two graders (maybe more if "contentious"). So that means that two graders authenticated this 1914 CJ reprint, the T206 EPDG Cy Young Reprint that was discussed here a few months back (dont have pic), and so many altered cards that BODA finds?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Its noteworthy that the guy states that every card is reviewed by at least two graders (maybe more if "contentious"). So that means that two graders authenticated this 1914 CJ reprint, the T206 EPDG Cy Young Reprint that was discussed here a few months back (dont have pic), and so many altered cards that BODA finds?

I don't believe it, myself. The math barely works with one reviewer per card.

[Casey2296]

I like the "my wife didn't give me any" or "traffic was horrendous coming in" vibe as an excuse for grumpy graders to downgrade. Someone needs to manage those power tripping special snowflakes, maybe a Snickers bar. Oh wait, the PSA big cheese is a member here, maybe he'll read this and tell his graders to not be such emotional basket cases on the daily and do their jobs.

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Its noteworthy that the guy states that every card is reviewed by at least two graders (maybe more if "contentious"). So that means that two graders authenticated this 1914 CJ reprint, the T206 EPDG Cy Young Reprint that was discussed here a few months back (dont have pic), and so many altered cards that BODA finds?

Maybe on higher grading tiers but my hunch is that even at the $200 level it is one set of eyes per card for a grade to be assigned. There is a verifier but that person simply "looks" at the card once it is in the holder. I suspect 2 secs per card is spent on that part of the grading process.

[Johnny630]

Isn’t that AI machine grading cards now ? Or is that just high end cards that are being scanned ?

[atx840]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

the T206 EPDG Cy Young Reprin

WTF PSA

[Rhotchkiss]

Nice Chris!

[brianp-beme]

Originally Posted by atx840

WTF PSA

I love big borders I cannot lie, even blatant reprints on the sly.

Brian

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Its noteworthy that the guy states that every card is reviewed by at least two graders (maybe more if "contentious"). So that means that two graders authenticated this 1914 CJ reprint, the T206 EPDG Cy Young Reprint that was discussed here a few months back (dont have pic), and so many altered cards that BODA finds?

The graders are human. They make mistakes. For every one of these that slips through the cracks, they probably correctly reject 5,000+, but you never see the rejections, you only see the ones that slip through the cracks.

As far as BODA's "altered" cards goes... some of their posts are just getting ridiculous now. It's starting to become like the boy who cried wolf over there. I've lost count of how many cards they post where they say something along the lines of "I couldn't prove any alterations on this one, but posting anyhow for reference" or "I haven't identified the alteration on this, but I suspect there is one because 'a***a' submitted it". Meanwhile, there are 20,000+ "a***a" buyers on eBay, not to mention eBay assigns the same account DIFFERENT hidden ID's on every transaction lol. If you look at cards I've bought, my hidden ID tag is different on all of them. It's no wonder the FBI shrugged their shoulders after being presented with the evidence. Don't get me wrong, they've also found a ton of truly altered cards too, but the vast majority of those almost certainly couldn't be detected without a before (AND AFTER) scan of the same card side by side. Not to mention the hobby can't even agree on what counts as an "alteration" to begin with. And even if they could, that still wouldn't make it a crime to clean a card just because a group of ultra-purist collectors disapprove of it. These guys can sit there and dig up a million of these cards and it wouldn't change a thing. If anything, they're drawing MORE attention to what can be done to a card and what can't be detected. I would wager good money that the aftermath of BODA's efforts will actually result in MORE altered cards being graded than before. The FBI clearly doesn't care and neither does the hobby. If you think the next time that Honus Wagner PSA 8 trades hands that it's going to go for anything other than a new record because everyone knows it's trimmed, you're only kidding yourself. And the 1952 Mantle that started the whole BODA "investigation" thread? I'd take that card any day and would be more than happy to pay top dollar for it.

[Johnny630]

The FBI clearly doesn't care and neither does the hobby. If you think the next time that Honus Wagner PSA 8 trades hands that it's going to go for anything other than a new record because everyone knows it's trimmed, you're only kidding yourself. And the 1952 Mantle that started the whole BODA "investigation" thread? I'd take that card any day and would be more than happy to pay top dollar for it.

Quote from Snowmam Above.

Sadly I think this is where we are at in this hobby right now. People just don’t care anymore they’re numb to it.

[samosa4u]

What BODA has done is just awesome. I have nothing but respect for those guys. However, Mr. Snowman does have some solid points.

Originally Posted by Snowman

I've lost count of how many cards they post where they say something along the lines of "I couldn't prove any alterations on this one, but posting anyhow for reference" or "I haven't identified the alteration on this, but I suspect there is one because 'a***a' submitted it".

Yeah, that's a bit silly. Imagine having your ten-thousand dollar card posted up there, and yet they're not sure what was done on it. Now lots of people don't want to touch it ... gee thanks, guys.

Originally Posted by Snowman

Not to mention the hobby can't even agree on what counts as an "alteration" to begin with.

Another solid point. This has been discussed so many times on here and we all know how those threads went.

Originally Posted by Snowman

If anything, they're drawing MORE attention to what can be done to a card and what can't be detected. I would wager good money that the aftermath of BODA's efforts will actually result in MORE altered cards being graded than before.

This is actually very scary and it's probably true. Imagine writing a book titled "How to get Altered Cards past Graders" and putting it online for free! BODA points out every little detail here and there, and this is just the perfect way to educate others on how to commit fraud.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by Snowman

The graders are human. They make mistakes. For every one of these that slips through the cracks, they probably correctly reject 5,000+, but you never see the rejections, you only see the ones that slip through the cracks.

As far as BODA's "altered" cards goes... some of their posts are just getting ridiculous now. It's starting to become like the boy who cried wolf over there. I've lost count of how many cards they post where they say something along the lines of "I couldn't prove any alterations on this one, but posting anyhow for reference" or "I haven't identified the alteration on this, but I suspect there is one because 'a***a' submitted it". Meanwhile, there are 20,000+ "a***a" buyers on eBay, not to mention eBay assigns the same account DIFFERENT hidden ID's on every transaction lol. If you look at cards I've bought, my hidden ID tag is different on all of them. It's no wonder the FBI shrugged their shoulders after being presented with the evidence. Don't get me wrong, they've also found a ton of truly altered cards too, but the vast majority of those almost certainly couldn't be detected without a before (AND AFTER) scan of the same card side by side. Not to mention the hobby can't even agree on what counts as an "alteration" to begin with. And even if they could, that still wouldn't make it a crime to clean a card just because a group of ultra-purist collectors disapprove of it. These guys can sit there and dig up a million of these cards and it wouldn't change a thing. If anything, they're drawing MORE attention to what can be done to a card and what can't be detected. I would wager good money that the aftermath of BODA's efforts will actually result in MORE altered cards being graded than before. The FBI clearly doesn't care and neither does the hobby. If you think the next time that Honus Wagner PSA 8 trades hands that it's going to go for anything other than a new record because everyone knows it's trimmed, you're only kidding yourself. And the 1952 Mantle that started the whole BODA "investigation" thread? I'd take that card any day and would be more than happy to pay top dollar for it.

This isn't the PSA board, no need to be such an apologist.

The volume of "mistakes" they make is way beyond what's acceptable in any other job.

[Hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by Snowman

The graders are human. They make mistakes. For every one of these that slips through the cracks, they probably correctly reject 5,000+, but you never see the rejections, you only see the ones that slip through the cracks.



As far as BODA's "altered" cards goes... some of their posts are just getting ridiculous now. It's starting to become like the boy who cried wolf over there. I've lost count of how many cards they post where they say something along the lines of "I couldn't prove any alterations on this one, but posting anyhow for reference" or "I haven't identified the alteration on this, but I suspect there is one because 'a***a' submitted it". Meanwhile, there are 20,000+ "a***a" buyers on eBay, not to mention eBay assigns the same account DIFFERENT hidden ID's on every transaction lol. If you look at cards I've bought, my hidden ID tag is different on all of them. It's no wonder the FBI shrugged their shoulders after being presented with the evidence. Don't get me wrong, they've also found a ton of truly altered cards too, but the vast majority of those almost certainly couldn't be detected without a before (AND AFTER) scan of the same card side by side. Not to mention the hobby can't even agree on what counts as an "alteration" to begin with. And even if they could, that still wouldn't make it a crime to clean a card just because a group of ultra-purist collectors disapprove of it. These guys can sit there and dig up a million of these cards and it wouldn't change a thing. If anything, they're drawing MORE attention to what can be done to a card and what can't be detected. I would wager good money that the aftermath of BODA's efforts will actually result in MORE altered cards being graded than before. The FBI clearly doesn't care and neither does the hobby. If you think the next time that Honus Wagner PSA 8 trades hands that it's going to go for anything other than a new record because everyone knows it's trimmed, you're only kidding yourself. And the 1952 Mantle that started the whole BODA "investigation" thread? I'd take that card any day and would be more than happy to pay top dollar for it.

Good for you. Enjoy your altered art projects. I prefer factory creations, not a Moser special.

And we now have some reference out there that can help collectors who don't want altered crap.

So BODA does plenty of good.

Sent from my SM-G981U using Tapatalk

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Its noteworthy that the guy states that every card is reviewed by at least two graders (maybe more if "contentious"). So that means that two graders authenticated this 1914 CJ reprint, the T206 EPDG Cy Young Reprint that was discussed here a few months back (dont have pic), and so many altered cards that BODA finds?

That's scary that multiple graders and this like this happen

[slidekellyslide]

PSA is a complete shit show. It was a shit show before Nat took it over and he has somehow made it worse. My latest sub just popped and it’s a friggin joke. Besides slabbing my 1913 World Series ticket stub as a game 2 instead of what it actually is, a game 3 their grades are a joke. I’ve slabbed lots of cards over the years. 9-10s on cardboard cards are now 8s. The lone 10 I got of course was a shiny modern card. And it wasn’t just me, I subbed this with some of the best eyes in the hobby and every single member of this sub got screwed over. 400 card sub. Grader Of Death.

[Leon]

I taste a little throw up in my mouth when I look at that card. It's a real shame when someone pays good money to got the completely wrong answer. And an answer any 6th grader could see if they compared that one to a real one. Not anywhere close...

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Its noteworthy that the guy states that every card is reviewed by at least two graders (maybe more if "contentious"). So that means that two graders authenticated this 1914 CJ reprint, the T206 EPDG Cy Young Reprint that was discussed here a few months back (dont have pic), and so many altered cards that BODA finds?

[Johnny630]

Has anyone ever received this back from PSA ??

I never have in 30 years.

Is this on the research department ?

How could they not know what card this is ?