Ridiculous

[barrysloate]

The prices do seem crazy but the label says "10" and that's what they are buying. The "9" may look just as nice but the label doesn't read "10", it reads "9." And that's all the difference in the world.

You also have to appreciate just how much money some people have, so paying six figures sums for some of these cards may not be a big deal to them.

I find the sale fascinating and the question I would ask is not how someone could afford 432K for a Clemente, but why someone would actually think it is worth that much. I bet you would get some interesting answers.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

I find the sale fascinating and the question I would ask is not how someone could afford 432K for a Clemente, but why someone would actually think it is worth that much. I bet you would get some interesting answers.

For friendly debate........I am not saying this as necessarily a bad thing but I think I can sum up why it is worth 423k in one word. Ego.

I even admit to collecting and having an "ego" doing it. Why would we ever pay 100s or 1000s for these pieces of cardboard otherwise.

[RichardSimon]

Leon - I am rarely on this side of the board but this thread caught my eye, and your analysis hit the nail on the head.
EGO,,, mine is better than yours, mine is bigger than yours,, older, rich white men playing with what was originally children's cardboard.
To each his own I guess.
Oh, and let's not forget the power of the PSA Set Registry and the ego involved with that. The autograph/memorabilia guys that I know tend to chuckle about registry sets but the marketing genius at PSA who dreamed that one up does deserve a bonus.
I think many if not all collectors do have some ego about what they have. On the autograph side why do so many of us frame our pieces and mount them on walls all over our homes. I know I do . I love it when a visitor makes a glowing comment about my Thomas Jefferson or Abraham Lincoln signed documents.

[barrysloate]

Ego is absolutely part of the equation. Maybe the winning bidder believes this is the best Clemente rookie known. Maybe if he was told it was the fourth best he wouldn't even have placed a bid. Who knows. But one thing I believe is he really does think the card is worth that much money. I don't think just because people have a lot of money they are willing to make stupid purchases. Bill Gates can afford to pay $1000 for a hamburger but he never will because he knows no burger is worth that. So I bet the winning bidder will not only tell you he got a good deal but that it was undervalued. And maybe next time around someone will pay him 600K and he'll turn out to be right.

[glchen]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

Ego is absolutely part of the equation. Maybe the winning bidder believes this is the best Clemente rookie known. Maybe if he was told it was the fourth best he wouldn't even have placed a bid. Who knows. But one thing I believe is he really does think the card is worth that much money. I don't think just because people have a lot of money they are willing to make stupid purchases. Bill Gates can afford to pay $1000 for a hamburger but he never will because he knows no burger is worth that. So I bet the winning bidder will not only tell you he got a good deal but that it was undervalued. And maybe next time around someone will pay him 600K and he'll turn out to be right.

The winning bidder for the Clemente posted his thoughts on the PSA board here: Link

Basically, copying his post, this is what he said:

"I also agree that in many cases a sweet 9 is just as appealing as a 10, visually very hard to see the difference...I would have bought a Clemente RC in a 9 if I ever had the chance at a nice one, but the only one I remember seeing for sale in the past 10 yrs had an iffy corner, so I had to make a decision...I typically wont replace 9s with 10s, for example I have a 54 Aaron 9 that actually belonged to Dmitri which he sold bc he was pissed it didnt get it a 10, it is a great looking card and every bit as nice to me as the 2 10s Ive seen. This was more a special situation of actually needing the card, not bumping up from a 9 to a 10. Though I admit on the Brock I have 2 9s and decided to buy the 10 and trade or sell the 9s to fill in other gaps in my collection."

[barrysloate]

Thanks Gary for the link, although I'm not sure I fully understand why he simply didn't wait for a reasonably nice 9 to come along, since it would have been acceptable to him and cost about 1/20th of the amount he paid for the 10.

Interesting what he said about Dmitiri Young being pissed because one of his 9's didn't get bumped to a 10. I can only imagine what was going on behind the scenes between Young and the graders with respect to his collection.

[Abravefan11]

Barry your post raises a couple of good questions I think.

Originally Posted by barrysloate

...although I'm not sure I fully understand why he simply didn't wait for a reasonably nice 9 to come along, since it would have been acceptable to him and cost about 1/20th of the amount he paid for the 10.

The buyer stated that he had been looking for a reasonable 9 for 10 years and passed on the only 9 he had seen because he felt the grade was suspect. Isn't that a good example of a high grade collector buying the card and not the holder? Isn't that the exact opposite of how many people claim high grade or registry collectors approach their purchases?

Originally Posted by barrysloate

Interesting what he said about Dmitiri Young being pissed because one of his 9's didn't get bumped to a 10. I can only imagine what was going on behind the scenes between Young and the graders with respect to his collection.

Supposing the story of Young being angry is true, doesn't that show the TPG company standing behind their grade in the face of great pressure from a wealthy force in the hobby? That's counter to what many people claim is often the case as well.

[Al C.risafulli]

I used to work for a guy who would only drive a Mercedes. He had five or six of them, and if you asked him why he didn't sell one and buy a Cadillac, a Ferrarri, a Ford Taurus or whatever, he'd reply that he would only drive "the best car." It didn't matter if it was a completely subjective thing, in his opinion, Mercedes was the "best."

In some people's opinion, a PSA 10 is "the best." It's just another way to collect. I have no issue with it.

-Al

[bh3443]

While I admit not having the means to buy an Aaron 9 or 10 or even an 8, I'm pretty happy with the ones I've had from PSA that were 1.5, 4 and 5!

My ego used to go along with my collecting but in a different way: More cards were better! I'd rather have a dozen Aaron Rookies in all grades than just one pretty darn perfect one!

Richard, yes, that PSA registry idea is a goldmine!

Great article, I really do enjoy that sight. However, this one's my favorite!
From the amount of posts I've made, I see I like to talk!

I've had a bunch of fellow Net 54 friends over my house and I am in contact daily with so many of you. Whether it's doing a deal or just saying hello, I love to say that the finest hobyists I've ever known are the crew here on 54.
I find it comforting to know the future of our hobby is safe as it resides HERE!

Have a great day my friends,
Bill Hedin

[hammer]

For me if I had a extra $450,00.00 I would buy a new house.

[alanu]

Originally Posted by hammer

For me if I had a extra $450,00.00 I would buy a new house.

The difference is, the guy who bought this card probably has an extra $45 million laying around.

Besides ego as a reason for buying this card, if he/she sells it for $500K next year, to make money would be another reason.

[campyfan39]

PSA is the only winner in the scenario. No doubt they are flooded with submissions seeking the regrading of 8-9's.

[barrysloate]

Tim- here are a few further thoughts regarding your comments:

Kudos to the buyer for being patient and waiting for the 10, and not rushing to buy a 9 he didn't like. My question: a 9 is a Mint card, isn't it supposed to be virtually perfect? Sounds like the 9's he looked at may have been overgraded. Why didn't he like the 9's? He even noted one of the 9's he saw had a bad corner- well that's not a Mint card in my book.

Regarding Dmitri Young complaining about a 9 that didn't get the 10 he felt it deserved: Can we assume that that was the only card he complained about? Is it possible he complained about many and got some bumped up to 10's? Can't say for sure, but I'm a suspicious guy by nature, and I'm finding his whole collection a bit puzzling. How did he get so many 10's in the first place? If I submitted those exact cards, would I get the same 10's? I know he didn't submit them all, some were sold to him already graded 10. Let's just say I would love to find out more about this collection, and the history of how the cards got the grades they did. Yes, they all look really nice. But like I said, I'm suspicious of everything.

[Abravefan11]

Barry - If I read that correctly he said in the 10 years he looked he saw one 9. It was the only one he had the opportunity to buy and it had a corner he questioned so he chose to pass on it. After years of looking when the grade 10 was offered he decided the premium was worth paying to end the pursuit of a card within his desired condition parameters.

Regarding Young's collection I think it's fair to want to know as many details as possible. But without the details people assume and in most cases they are skeptical and assume the worst. I just wanted to point out two instances within the story that directly contradict common assumptions made about high grade collector's and TPG companies.

[Exhibitman]

To paraphrase Robin Williams: PSA 10s are God's way of telling you that you make too much money.

[kcohen]

I find the characterization of "ludicrous" as overly judgmental. If you've got the bucks and it brings you some pleasure, whether it be ego-driven, investment-driven or whatever, why not? Each to his own.

[CMIZ5290]

WONDER WHAT A PSA 10 COBB GREEN PORTRAIT WOULD BRING??

[Leon]

Just to be clear if I wasn't. I have NO issue whatsoever with folks doing what they want to with their money. I think it's awesome that folks have the coin to buy what they want. No hard feelings or judgement on my side.

[sportscardtheory]

Originally Posted by RichardSimon

Leon - I am rarely on this side of the board but this thread caught my eye, and your analysis hit the nail on the head.
EGO,,, mine is better than yours, mine is bigger than yours,, older, rich white men playing with what was originally children's cardboard.
To each his own I guess.
Oh, and let's not forget the power of the PSA Set Registry and the ego involved with that. The autograph/memorabilia guys that I know tend to chuckle about registry sets but the marketing genius at PSA who dreamed that one up does deserve a bonus.
I think many if not all collectors do have some ego about what they have. On the autograph side why do so many of us frame our pieces and mount them on walls all over our homes. I know I do . I love it when a visitor makes a glowing comment about my Thomas Jefferson or Abraham Lincoln signed documents.

Sorry, I saw this and had to say something. You do know who bought and sold this, right? I don't know what "old and white" has to do with anything when it was a 38 year old black man who just sold this collection.

Originally Posted by sportscardtheory

Sorry, I saw this and had to say something. You do know who bought and sold this, right? I don't know what "old and white" has to do with anything when it was a 38 year old black man who just sold this collection.

Has nothing to do with who bought and then sold it. We are talking about the person who has bought it now and I think he is implying that most people buying these types of cards for collections fall in to the Older White Guy demographic. There is a lot evidence to prove that comment also. Look at the make-up of the board. Most of the big $ collectors fall in the over 40 age.

[Matthew H]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

Has nothing to do with who bought and then sold it. We are talking about the person who has bought it now and I think he is implying that most people buying these types of cards for collections fall in to the Older White Guy demographic. There is a lot evidence to prove that comment also. Look at the make-up of the board. Most of the big $ collectors fall in the over 40 age.

The guy who bought it is under 40.

[wonkaticket]

I can't wait till I'm 40 I hear that's the sweet spot.