How are the deceased still signing?

[travrosty]

yeah, his little known brother jon louis.

haha

how either psa or jsa certed this just proves to me they know little to nothing about joe louis' signature.

but not the first time they have goofed up louis' signature. i have seen several others both with psa and jsa certification, including some 8 x 10 signed photos which have been listed on ebay for 4000 dollars.

this Joe Louis autograph would be flagged 5 seconds into my inspection and laughed right out of the building, but either spence or grad or their underlings carefully considered it and gave it the thumbs up? WTH?

Why are these two guys considered by Leaf or anyone else better than all the rest of us? I just don't get it either.

[Exhibitman]

I believe that bad Louis is a secretarial. I have a similar one inscribed that I got a long time ago. The "L" is what made me think of it.

[RichardSimon]

then the Leaf site should list it as a secretarial 1/1 from the Executive Collection. Wow, what an honor for the owner.
What about the rest of us who are not Executives?
Talk about the blind leading the blind.

[travrosty]

People have made their own cards like this in the past, but this is the first time i have seen a credible brand name put to these cards where people can design their own.

leaf, you have joined the greedy ranks of the insert card hucksters.

[Bilko G]

Originally Posted by travrosty

People have made their own cards like this in the past, but this is the first time i have seen a credible brand name put to these cards where people can design their own.

leaf, you have joined the greedy ranks of the insert card hucksters.

you do know this isn't the original Leaf company, right? Or even the one that was around in the 80s and 90s, either, right?



A well known Hobby dealer/businessman named Brian Gray purchased the Leaf name about 2 years ago. Before this Brian Gray had started his own card company called "Razor". Razor made a big splash a few years ago by signing all the top MLB draft picks from 2008 (I believe) to exclusive autograph contracts. These "Exclusives" kept other companies like Topps unable to create autographed cards of these top picks until they actually played an official MLB game. As im sure you guys know, it takes top picks sometimes 3, 4 or 5 years to get into an official MLB game.

Anyways, Brian's card company "Razor" had a bit of a following with the collectors that like top draft picks and top prospects, generally these people are called "Prospectors" as they like to buy in cheap and sell for a big profit if/when the player makes a big splash in the majors. Brian decided though that he wanted a more established name for his company and when the Leaf name came up, he bought it and changed his card company to Leaf. Brian and Leaf are based out of Texas, Dallas i believe but not 100% sure.

[Bilko G]

Originally Posted by travrosty

yeah, his little known brother jon louis.

haha

how either psa or jsa certed this just proves to me they know little to nothing about joe louis' signature.

but not the first time they have goofed up louis' signature. i have seen several others both with psa and jsa certification, including some 8 x 10 signed photos which have been listed on ebay for 4000 dollars.

this Joe Louis autograph would be flagged 5 seconds into my inspection and laughed right out of the building, but either spence or grad or their underlings carefully considered it and gave it the thumbs up? WTH?

Why are these two guys considered by Leaf or anyone else better than all the rest of us? I just don't get it either.

The Joe Louis is JSA certed BTW

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by Bilko G

The Joe Louis is JSA certed BTW

I would have guessed jsa. Although i wouldn't have been surprised by either company certing this. I see spence on the "all star dealers" show on tv, and the dealer on the show says he is the best, and spence shows up and plugs in his 30,000 spectral comparator machine and we are all suppose to be impressed. The best? Well, ok!!!!

[RichardSimon]

When I worked for PSA we discussed that machine and the thinking was it was worth buying, even though we did not think we would ever use it. It sounded good to have it was what we thought.

[travrosty]

the way he authenticates on that show is not what happens most of the time in real life i do not believe. he made it look careful and deliberate , but in reality, some of the time they look at a ball for a few seconds, make a determination on it, and put a sticker on it, and move on to the next ball.

They are not putting every ball in the machine like that.

I notice spence touts his 'certificate' in forensics when it serves his purpose, but then badmouths forensics (like in the authentication forum at a convention, when badmouthing it serves his purpose. trying to have it both ways. so if you like forensics, he's your man, and if you don't like forensics, then he's your man too!

[RichardSimon]

When I worked for PSA they had us take a correspondence course from an FDE.
The course was about handwriting analysis. It was offered by an old FDE named Andrew Bradley.
All four of the authenticators received a certificate upon completing this course.
That is all the "forensic" training we had with PSA.