Please help, fake or real Babe Ruth

[PhilNap]

With the two wrappers in the current SCP auction (one with the all too common obscured middle initial "H" and one with the "H" intact), it has caused me to look even closer at these wrappers.

It seems that all of the wrappers with the obscured "H" have a much sharper font style. I would describe it as more of a modern computer generated font. This is most pronounced in the text below the Babe's image where it reads "Babe Ruth's Own Candy". And upon closer look, it is evident in all of the text (both in the area with the orange background and in the white border). The wrappers with the "H" have more of a rounded hand drawn style of text. I don't know if this version has been reproduced but in my opinion the missing "H" and the sharper font are tell tale signs to stay away.

[Mr. Zipper]

Also note that in lot 754, the quote marks around Babe Ruth's (at top of label) are of different style and spacing relative to the letters. The same with the apostrophe.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Mr. Zipper

Also note that in lot 754, the quote marks around Babe Ruth's (at top of label) are of different style and spacing relative to the letters. The same with the apostrophe.

That is interesting. If the wrapper is a reprint, there are two possibilities - either it is a scan/photo copy of an original, or someone created new artwork and layout and printed from that. With your discovery, either one of those possibilities seems to be a bit challenged. Because the quotation mark is different, it would seem impossible for it to be a photo copy, and it would indicate someone made a new layout and tried to make it as close to the real thing as possible. The challenge on that side is that the H is obscured, which wouldn't happen if someone was printing off of a fresh layout. That leaves two more likely possibilities in my mind - either there were two original layouts for the wrapper, or someone created a new layout recently and that layout was copied from a copy where the H was obscured.

[PhilNap]

Originally Posted by Matt

That is interesting. If the wrapper is a reprint, there are two possibilities - either it is a scan/photo copy of an original, or someone created new artwork and layout and printed from that. With your discovery, either one of those possibilities seems to be a bit challenged. Because the quotation mark is different, it would seem impossible for it to be a photo copy, and it would indicate someone made a new layout and tried to make it as close to the real thing as possible. The challenge on that side is that the H is obscured, which wouldn't happen if someone was printing off of a fresh layout. That leaves two more likely possibilities in my mind - either there were two original layouts for the wrapper, or someone created a new layout recently and that layout was copied from a copy where the H was obscured.

Or the H was intentionally obscured as part of the effort to artificially age the new creation.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by PhilNap

Or the H was intentionally obscured as part of the effort to artificially age the new creation.

That's the same as the last option I gave - you're just suggesting intent.

[perezfan]

Since SCP currently has both types in their possession, it would be nice if they would "Blacklight" them (side by side). It would be interesting to see the comparison.

But I supose that's probably too much to ask...

[PhilNap]

Here's mine under blacklight with a 1928 Exhibits card and a modern 3x5.

[Bugsy]

I posted a photo of mine earlier (damaged H.). Anyway, I don't know why I didn't think of it before, but I put it under a black light last night. Modern paper illuminates under a black light because of chemicals used in the manufacturing process, while paper from the 1920s should not. I put an early postcard with the similar coloring beside the wrapper to show the difference.

Not only does the wrapper illuminate under the light, look at the creases. They are even brighter. If the wax, or whatever coating is on the paper, were stripped away, I am sure this sucker would really light up under a black light.

What do you guys think of this? Does this pretty much guarantee that this is a fake?

Thanks.

Chris

BTW, the whole wrapper illuminated under black lighting, but my camera didn't capture it well. No flash in a dark room with a cheap camera made it a little tricky.

[smotan_02]

Amazing, great work. That would be a good practice for the auction house.

[gnaz01]

Originally Posted by Bugsy

I posted a photo of mine earlier (damaged H.). Anyway, I don't know why I didn't think of it before, but I put it under a black light last night. Modern paper illuminates under a black light because of chemicals used in the manufacturing process, while paper from the 1920s should not. I put an early postcard with the similar coloring beside the wrapper to show the difference.

Not only does the wrapper illuminate under the light, look at the creases. They are even brighter. If the wax, or whatever coating is on the paper, were stripped away, I am sure this sucker would really light up under a black light.

What do you guys think of this? Does this pretty much guarantee that this is a fake?

Thanks.

Chris

BTW, the whole wrapper illuminated under black lighting, but my camera didn't capture it well. No flash in a dark room with a cheap camera made it a little tricky.

Chris, is that the one you bought from Leon??

[Bugsy]

Originally Posted by gnaz01

Chris, is that the one you bought from Leon??

Yes, it is. It failed the blacklight test so I can't imagine there is any way that it could be genuine.

I seems like a lot of others had the damaged H wrapper, so it would be nice to have a few more voices chime in. Anyone else test theirs under a black light?

Thanks again!

Chris

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Bugsy

Yes, it is. It failed the blacklight test so I can't imagine there is any way that it could be genuine.

I seems like a lot of others had the damaged H wrapper, so it would be nice to have a few more voices chime in. Anyone else test theirs under a black light?

Thanks again!

Chris

Hi Chris
I haven't followed this thread for a few days. If it failed the test then just shoot me an email and let me know what you paid and I will fully refund you. I need to check my current one too, I guess. My email is leonl@flash.net. Everything I ever sell has a lifetime warranty for authenticity. My apologies too. Of course I had no idea. Also, I would like to get it back to keep as a comparison. I will pay shipping both ways too.... thanks...

[PhilNap]

Originally Posted by PhilNap

With the two wrappers in the current SCP auction (one with the all too common obscured middle initial "H" and one with the "H" intact), it has caused me to look even closer at these wrappers.

It seems that all of the wrappers with the obscured "H" have a much sharper font style. I would describe it as more of a modern computer generated font. This is most pronounced in the text below the Babe's image where it reads "Babe Ruth's Own Candy". And upon closer look, it is evident in all of the text (both in the area with the orange background and in the white border). The wrappers with the "H" have more of a rounded hand drawn style of text. I don't know if this version has been reproduced but in my opinion the missing "H" and the sharper font are tell tale signs to stay away.

It seems that people may be recognizing . . .

Prices Realized with BP:

Lot 752 - $1,355.00
Lot 744 - $290.00 (also included a 1934 Goudey wrapper)

[earlywynnfan]

Originally Posted by PhilNap

It seems that people may be recognizing . . .

Prices Realized with BP:

Lot 752 - $1,355.00
Lot 744 - $290.00 (also included a 1934 Goudey wrapper)

Is it me, or is the circle around "Own Candy" different in these? There seems to be more space in the second one.

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com