Do-over. heritage relists no sale psa, jsa 1939 controversial signedinduction program

[travrosty]

Here are the two Ty Cobb signatures in question.

Not even the same type of signature, one is the mushroom top Ty, and the other is the 2 variation of Ty. Now either Ty Cobb was switching them up over that weekend or something isn't right. The 2 variation is more rare, and it would seem unlikely he switched back and forth, but let's look at the autographs.

On the ink signature, the tail on the y in Ty comes down to the right, not cobbs usual style of signing the letter y. The bb's in Cobb are quite different between the two signature, and the pencil signature really looks bad, it's quite a childish rendition and the letter C is frightening to me. I say these are no good in my opinion, especiallly compared to a genuine Cobb that is shown on the Haulsofshame.com website.

What do you think of these Cobb's? Are any of these Cobb's good? Why such a startling difference in the way he signed between two programs that were suppose to be signed over the same induction weekend, and come with psa and jsa approval?

[travrosty]

Correctin - I called it induction "weekend" but the festivities officially started on a monday.

[thekingofclout]

Now, I'm certainly not taking sides here, as I've stated before, I have no expertise in signatures whatsoever.

But... how many times do you suppose Babe, Cobb, and the rest of the inductees scribbled their name on every item shoved in their faces for the few days that was the Grand Opening Festivals at Cooperstown?

The Post Office alone sold thousands upon thousands of First Day post cards, stamps, etc. This image is what they constantly endured during their whole visit in the completely packed little town.

BTW... This terrific little book is a great read, and tells the story of that historic event...

A Great Day in Cooperstown: The Improbable Birth of Baseball's Hall of Fame by Jim Reisler

cooperstownparade.jpg

[RichardSimon]

That is one cool photo.

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by RichardSimon

That is one cool photo.

I agree, very cool photo.

[travrosty]

Third autograph in this series is the already infamous Larrry Lajoie, with three R's.

As you can see the 3 R Lajoie is a rare animal. I don't think these are real, and I believe if the person who penned them could do it over again, he would probably retreive one of those R's.

You can see from one to the other, the capital L's vary as their loops look different and are inconsistent with their proportions, and the a in Lajoie has a more flourished, artsy look with the little loops in the ink example, and very simple, and straightforward in the pencil example. In my opinion, I don't think these are good. Any thoughts?

[RichardSimon]

When I was asked about them my second thought after chuckling over 3 R's was that the top loop on the L was way too long.
But I also know who else would have authenticated this piece and seen it wind up in a CC auction.
Agree Travis?

[travrosty]

Here is the Connie Mack signatures from both programs that were certed by psa and jsa. Notice how the ink signature on the 1939 program that featured the 3 R Larry Lajoie takes on a slant to the right, while the pencil signature on the 1939 induction day HOF program that is currently on its 2nd go round at Heritage as we speak stands upright, straight as an arrow, no slant.

The NN's in Connie slant to the right in the ink signature, while they don't seem to slant at all in the pencil signature. The E in Connie slants forward on the ink signature, and lays back on the pencil signature. Wow! That's quite a contrast and quite embarrassing.

Both signatures supposed to be signed on the same day back in 1939, and psa and jsa like them both. I don't like them, they don't match and they are just a couple more signatures that are contrived and dubious on this hit parade of autographs that come up snake eyes. How can they both be real as PSA and JSA claim? What exemplars were used.

Were any exemplars used?

Were any good exemplars used? How were the principles of handwriting analysis used on these pieces?

The pencil signature is especially childish and ridiculous. How did either of thsee get a coveted cert?

Give me your thoughts, and if you like JSA and PSA and still think they do a great job, especially on vintage baseball and sports, please come on here let your voice be heard.

[RichardSimon]

Here ya go guys, 5 more authenticated 1939 HOF induction pieces on the net.
I blew up the size of some of them so you could get a better look at the signatures, that accounts for the slight fuzzy look on a couple of them.
Any comments?