1927 Yankees team ball forgery

[steve B]

That sort of thing does happen, and I suspect we'll see it more often as available technology gets cheaper and better.

An example from stamp collecting.
There was a group of stamps from a time when the BEP was experimenting. The group was supposedly printed on paper that had a higher clay content to help mitigate shrinkage of the sheet while drying. For the most part the paper was grayish and was known as "china clay paper" stamps on it were also rare and expensive. And nearly all the recognized ones had certs saying "it is genuine". Pretty clear cut right?

Until a couple kids (Literally) Wondered why some were more gray than others. And how you'd prove It was china clay paper. Enter a family member with access to a spectrograph, and a poor condition but certified stamp and a handful of the commo ones. Surprise! NO difference. so they asked around and got permission to test a few more of the special ones, both lighter and darker gray. Still no difference.
So the china clay papers were discredited and removed from the catalog.
They've gone from experimental rarities to oddities produced on defective paper.

And none of them would get a certificate today as anything else.

On the flip side, the once catalog listed imperforate coils that were delisted because they couldnlt be told apart from carefully cut regular stamps are now back because there are details of how they were cut that can now be checked.

Steve B

Originally Posted by travrosty

Some people see an old loa from psa and they ask for the piece to be "recertified" before they will buy it. Seems like an LOA is not all what it is cracked up to be. I have heard people say that you should look at an older psa cert with some skepticism because they didn't know as much back then.

But then what good is the LOA then if any LOA's issued before a certain year are looked at with a jaundiced eye? A guarantee would solve that problem. If they were so bad way back in the day, but issued a guarantee, let them pay for their mistakes. They took the customers money and put it in their pocket. They should be on the hook in some capacity if they screw up.

But they didnt issue a guarantee, so customers are stuck trying to figure out when the cutoff date is. Hint:there isn't any. It's as bad now as it was then.

[Frozen in Time]

As some of you may know, I am a relatively new member of the forums and focus primarily on vintage photos of Mantle. That being said, I have been absolutely fascinated by this and similar threads dealing with the authenticity of autographs, some of which have been very helpful for me in evaluating Mickey's signature.

So realizing that I am not in any way an expert on autographs but have been shocked and amazed at the number of forgeries being discussed here (and obviously on other sites and publications) I would like to ask what I suspect is a really naive (and perhaps stupid) question:

Given the almost unanimous opinion here that Coaches Corner Auctions continuously lists obvious fakes and the repeated mention in the forums of work(s) done by the same forger(s) or similar statements implying that the identity of the forger(s) may be known to someone why do those with such information not inform the branch of the FBI that deals with these matters?

Would not the FBI be interested in at least looking into these suspected cases of fraud (backed by the observations posted on the forums as reasonable cause to investigate) and would not such FBI interest deter those who continue to profit from their deception and criminal behavior?

It just seems to me that some steps have to be taken to stop this nonsense that is ruining the hobby and that (based on their posts) at least some on these forums have the knowledge (and perhaps evidence) to help.

[Bigdaddy]

I know it's been said here before, but once again, thanks David for stepping up (in a public forum even) and showing us the forged '27 Yankees ball. Any time an example can be raised and we, as a community, can learn something from it, then we're all a bit better for it.

[RichardSimon]

Originally Posted by Frozen in Time

As some of you may know, I am a relatively new member of the forums and focus primarily on vintage photos of Mantle. That being said, I have been absolutely fascinated by this and similar threads dealing with the authenticity of autographs, some of which have been very helpful for me in evaluating Mickey's signature.

So realizing that I am not in any way an expert on autographs but have been shocked and amazed at the number of forgeries being discussed here (and obviously on other sites and publications) I would like to ask what I suspect is a really naive (and perhaps stupid) question:

Given the almost unanimous opinion here that Coaches Corner Auctions continuously lists obvious fakes and the repeated mention in the forums of work(s) done by the same forger(s) or similar statements implying that the identity of the forger(s) may be known to someone why do those with such information not inform the branch of the FBI that deals with these matters?

Would not the FBI be interested in at least looking into these suspected cases of fraud (backed by the observations posted on the forums as reasonable cause to investigate) and would not such FBI interest deter those who continue to profit from their deception and criminal behavior?

It just seems to me that some steps have to be taken to stop this nonsense that is ruining the hobby and that (based on their posts) at least some on these forums have the knowledge (and perhaps evidence) to help.

Believe me we all are hoping that law enforcement does something more.
But knowledge and evidence are two different things.

[David Atkatz]

Especially when the high priests keep the knowledge secret.

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

Especially when the high priests keep the knowledge secret.

What do you mean by that comment?

[novakjr]

C'mon David, really? This was a somewhat reasonable and informative thread. At one point in this thread you noted that one of the reasons you began to suspect this ball is because of Chris' posts. And then you get bored and start poking at him. C'mon, seriously. You gotta knock that off...

[David Atkatz]

My post had nothing at all to do with Chris. He can flatter himself and think that it does, but, regardless, it does not.