1927 Yankees team ball forgery

[steve B]

Originally Posted by murphusa

If I go to purchased a house and it needed a soil test for the spectic tank etc and a company gave me a certificate that said "in their opinion based on such and such" that the soil was ok and then I buy the house but find out 10 years latter that their results were not up to standards and that was the reason for illness etc.

Wouldn't I be able to go to court, Why not here

I based my decession on a report that everything was OK, now I find out they are not

Because the soil test will be detailed. Not an opinion.

Here's what we tested for, and what we found at what level and how that compares to what the law allows.

If the testing was done wrong, yes you can pursue it.
If the allowable levels changed and are a problem now when they weren't 10 years ago....Maybe, but I doubt it would work.

If they say "we dug a hole and the dirt looks ok" that's just an opinion and is closer to a COA that the actual soil test.
The technology is available now to know a load of stuff about a signed item, but it's not quite cheap enough yet.


Steve B

[Caseyatbat]

David, you mentioned earlier in the thread this was a Spence ball. Was this ball fully authenticated with a full letter from JSA or PSA when Spence was with them? Or did it just come with an auction letter of authenticity or possibly only a verbal opinion?

[David Atkatz]

It was a James Spence letter from 1999, when he was on his own before PSA.

[Caseyatbat]

have you submitted it to be re-authenticated by PSA or JSA since you have owned it? Or possibly asked James Spence if he would stand behind his previous opinion and give this ball a new letter?

I am not saying I believe it would pass. There are several red flags that have already been pointed out in this thread. I just have never seen anybody give up on such a valuable item so quickly that was already authenticated by a top TPA just because of the opinion of 1 or 2 people.

[David Atkatz]

Don't worry, Casey--I haven't thrown it away. I'll probably show it to Jimmy, but it doesn't matter much to me what he says. As I said before, I saw some obviously forged work by this guy, and there was enough in common with my ball for me to seriously, seriously doubt it, myself. Jodi confirmed for me what I basically already knew, but wasn't willing to accept.

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by Caseyatbat

have you submitted it to be re-authenticated by PSA or JSA since you have owned it? Or possibly asked James Spence if he would stand behind his previous opinion and give this ball a new letter?

I am not saying I believe it would pass. There are several red flags that have already been pointed out in this thread. I just have never seen anybody give up on such a valuable item so quickly that was already authenticated by a top TPA just because of the opinion of 1 or 2 people.

Isn't Spence 1 person?

[Bilko G]

Originally Posted by travrosty

Isn't Spence 1 person?

Yes Spence is one person, but his company (of the same name) employs several different authenticators.

[Lordstan]

David,
I am very sorry to hear about this. It was such a magnificent item. Wow.
We all get fooled sometime.

I also give you a lot of credit for posting about it.

I hope you are able to find a way to be compensated, either through the owners of the auction house, even if it isn't in business, or though Spence. They get paid a lot of money. I think they should stand behind it. Just my 2c.

Best,
Mark

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by Bilko G

Yes Spence is one person, but his company (of the same name) employs several different authenticators.

Not at the time this ball was bought. in 1999. He said it was just spence.

He said Birkholm thought it was no good, and Birkholm worked for JSA. So does JSA think it is good or not? And would it have passed when Birkholm worked there? And would it pass now? Would Spence stick with his original authentication on this ball, or bail on it?

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by Caseyatbat

have you submitted it to be re-authenticated by PSA or JSA since you have owned it? Or possibly asked James Spence if he would stand behind his previous opinion and give this ball a new letter?

I am not saying I believe it would pass. There are several red flags that have already been pointed out in this thread. I just have never seen anybody give up on such a valuable item so quickly that was already authenticated by a top TPA just because of the opinion of 1 or 2 people.

I guarantee that ball would not pass PSA today.

As a matter of fact, it wouldn't have passed PSA five years ago.

[novakjr]

Why does it matter if it would pass today, or if it could be snuck by someone? David's being quite honorable with this one. He knows it's not authentic, so trying to get it to pass JSA is not what he's trying to do.. Getting something you know is not authentic to pass, does not make it any more authentic..

David, I admire what you're doing here, and I sincerely hope you're able to manage a way to get some sort of reimbursement.

[Mr. Zipper]

Originally Posted by novakjr

Why does it matter if it would pass today, or if it could be snuck by someone?

I think the point Chris was making was that the TPAs have since become aware of this forger's work and what once fooled them would no longer do so.

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by novakjr

Why does it matter if it would pass today, or if it could be snuck by someone? David's being quite honorable with this one. He knows it's not authentic, so trying to get it to pass JSA is not what he's trying to do.. Getting something you know is not authentic to pass, does not make it any more authentic..

David, I admire what you're doing here, and I sincerely hope you're able to manage a way to get some sort of reimbursement.

David, I was replying to a comment from "CaseyAtBat."