Vintage stadium experts- Anyone recognize this NL visitors dugout from 1938?

[Scott Garner]

Bump

[Chris-Counts]

Scott, is it possible it was taken during the spring? If so, it could have been taken in any number of minor league parks as well. Also, a ton of photos from this era were taken at the Reds spring training park in Tampa, FL. I have a spring training photo of Al Hollingsworth from about 1938 and he's wearing the same road jersey, even though he's posing in the Reds' park. By the way, I 'm really looking forward to seeing Greg's painting of the photo ...

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by Chris Counts

Scott, is it possible it was taken during the spring? If so, it could have been taken in any number of minor league parks as well. Also, a ton of photos from this era were taken at the Reds spring training park in Tampa, FL. I have a spring training photo of Al Hollingsworth from about 1938 and he's wearing the same road jersey, even though he's posing in the Reds' park. By the way, I 'm really looking forward to seeing Greg's painting of the photo ...

Chris,
Thanks for helping out. You may be on to something, there. Graig has already gone down the list of ML parks and none are a match. The dugout's overall condition (extremely low-tech- LOL) wouldn't discount your theory and could possibly support it.

Could this be a spring training shot? Quite possibly. I haven't received the picture yet, but it supposedly originates from The Sporting News' photo archive. Does anyone know if The Sporting News back issues are available online?

Maybe that's the way I can run down where this photo was shot....

Thanks, I can't wait to see it either.

[Lordstan]

Scott,
I believe that this definitely is a Spring Training/minor league stadium. It's hard for me to believe that any major league stadium in 1938 would be in that amount of disrepair.

Also,
I think that picture will be outstanding in Kreindlercolor. The mix of bright sun at the very front with varying degrees of shading as you progress toward the back of the picture is quite intriguing. In this picture it is amazing that while he is in shade, there is still enough light to create a shadow in the back wall of the dugout from his body. I think this type of light manipulation is really where Graig's talent shines through.(Hence all the comparisons to Rembrandt). I can't wait to see the final product.

Perhaps you could play around in photoshop, or similar, to test out different colors on the wood to see what you think looks the best.

Best,
Mark

[thecatspajamas]

Originally Posted by Scott Garner

Does anyone know if The Sporting News back issues are available online?

I believe you can view back issues of TSN via paperofrecord.com (for a paid subscription). Interestingly enough, my understanding is that the same access is included with SABR membership for about the same price as one of the lower-tier paperofrecord annual memberships.

All of this is hearsay as I haven't tried it out myself, but appears to be current as of July of this year:
http://www.baseball-fever.com/archiv...p/t-93213.html

Good luck!

[Scott Garner]

Mark,
Thanks! I'm with you in that I believe Graig's experise with the use of light is one of the things that's most amazing in his paintings. I thought that him painting this photo would be a great use of his talent.

Lance,
I appreciate the info and I will persue this further.

[jerseygary]

Unless my eyes are going, does his cap lack the Cincinnati "C" on it? If it is missing then this is definitely taken at spring training - the Reds used plain caps during the spring, that is, navy crown and red brim, no "C". I've seen countless spring training shots of the Reds circa 1938-41 and this is so. Not quite sure why, but maybe because once the rosters were settled the guys going with the big club had a "C" sewn on and those guys going to a minor league affiliate got what ever letter went with that teams uniform. Or maybe plain caps were cheap and disposed after spring training, who knows? The Brooklyn Dodgers also had a giveaway sign that a picture was taken at spring training - the "B" was embroidered on a separate piece of wool and then sewn onto the cap. When opening day came around these were exchanged for a regular cap with the "B" direct embroidered on the cap. The 1940's Pittsburgh Pirates were the same as Brooklyn.

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by jerseygary

Unless my eyes are going, does his cap lack the Cincinnati "C" on it? If it is missing then this is definitely taken at spring training - the Reds used plain caps during the spring, that is, navy crown and red brim, no "C". I've seen countless spring training shots of the Reds circa 1938-41 and this is so. Not quite sure why, but maybe because once the rosters were settled the guys going with the big club had a "C" sewn on and those guys going to a minor league affiliate got what ever letter went with that teams uniform. Or maybe plain caps were cheap and disposed after spring training, who knows? The Brooklyn Dodgers also had a giveaway sign that a picture was taken at spring training - the "B" was embroidered on a separate piece of wool and then sewn onto the cap. When opening day came around these were exchanged for a regular cap with the "B" direct embroidered on the cap. The 1940's Pittsburgh Pirates were the same as Brooklyn.

Gary and others that have attempted to help,

Merry Christmas!

I just received the actual 1938 Vander Meer photo today. Now that I have examined it up close, I can tell you that there definately is a Cincinnati "C" on the front of Vandy's hat, so not spring training. I have uploaded a better scan to look at this photo with more detail.

Additionally, I have scanned the back. It appears that the photo was taken by photographer William C. Greene from NY. It does appear that this photo ran in a Sunday edition of a NY area paper (see note on back indicating that the "photo crop as seen- Sunday".

I'm thinking that this photo was taken of Vander Meer in the visiting dugout of either the Polo Grounds or Ebbets Field in 1938.

Can any board member either confirm that the dugout shown is either the Polo Grounds or Ebbets or absolutely elimiminate either or both?
Also, have any of you early photo experts ever heard of a photographer named William C. Greene from NY?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Happy holidays!