Identification of Ruth Panel

[bcbgcbrcb]

My guess would be 1919 based on the Ruth pic, it is a famous photo that I believe was taken during his last season with Boston. It could have been from 1920 even but I don't think earlier than 1919.

[Jaybird]

Thanks Sean, Here's Heinie Groh. I agree, it's him and not Roush.

[Shoeless Moe]

I don't think the one in the upper right is Cicotte, but rather Ray Schalk

[jp1216]

Pic of O'Neill

[CW]

Nice catch, Exhibitman (sorry, can't recall your name...), I think you nailed
the "issue".

...and as pointed out by Sean and Paul, Mr. Ray Schalk:

[HRBAKER]

So if I read your OP correctly the description only misidentified 4 out of 6 possible. Not bad!

[milkit1]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

So if I read your OP correctly the description only misidentified 4 out of 6 possible. Not bad!

yeah and they used the best possible wrong player too. joe jackson and tris speaker ?!?! WTF?

[fkw]

just noticed in Adam's kit image that the square portrait cards were not always issued in 6 card panels, so I have to change my description....

I will call them "square portrait image" and "rectangular action image"

baseball players are found in both types



edited to add a picture of the baseball "rectangular action image" type

ruth, johnson, unknown, coveleski
who is the player in bottom left again??

[glchen]

Thanks for all of the updates. To summarize the findings, here are the players in the panel (team in panel along with years played on that team are in parens):

Panel 1

Top Row
Left: Heinie Groh (Reds): 1912-27 (1913-1921)
Right: Ray Shalk (White Sox): 1912-29 (1912-1928)

Middle Row:
Left: Eddie Collins (White Sox): 1906-1930 (1915-1926)
Right: Steve O'Neill (Indians): 1911-1925 (1911-1923)

Bottom Row:
Left: Rabbit Maranville (Braves): 1912-1935 (1912-1920, 1929-1925)
Right: Babe Ruth (Red Sox): 1914-1935 (1914-1919)

Panel 2 (from Rhett's Thread)

Top Row:
Left: Ray Shalk (White Sox): 1912-29 (1912-1928)
Right: Zach Wheat (Brooklyn): 1909-1927 (1909-1926)

Bottom Row:
Left: Steve O'Neill (Indians): 1911-1925 (1911-1923)
Right: Tris Speaker (Indians): 1907-1928 (1916-1926)


From these, it seems that the card can be categorized as:

Universal Toy and Novelty, c.1916-1919

although per Phil's post, since Ruth's picture is well known, it may be 1919-1920. Rhett's thread also implied that it was the later dates.

[fkw]

my vote would be "1920's" or just "1920"

there are other "portrait" cards (see the box display pics ) Cobb, Johnson, Alexander, Bancroft? (Giants)

whoever that NY Giants player is, is going to be the KEY in dating it IMO

also you missed one player in the "portrait" type, the bottom right player in the image with tape on the toploader (images was in one of the old threads).. someone said Thorpe? (unlikely) and someone said Toporser w/o his glasses? (very unlikely, average player started in 1921)

you must consider the other "action photo" type too, since the only known complete box contained them as well (Boxers), and someone pointed out the boxers are more likely from the early 20's.

the baseball player "action" cards are not going to be easy to date....
but looking at stats is unlikely Hornsby would make this set if it were made before 1920... (Ruth "batting", Sisler , Coveleski prob wouldnt made the set if issued before 1919)

quick list of Players seen on the "action" type are ...

Alexander (same pose as E121)
Hornsby
Ruth
Sisler (same pose as E121)
Coveleski
Johnson (same pose as E121)
and the 4 boxers

the boxers should date it better
and also the other stuff in box might help ie actress images etc.

another interesting thing is the image on front of box shows strip cards in a strip, these were more commonly sold post1919



love this stuff very interesting!

[FrankWakefield]

Frank, I agree with Jeff... as I scrolled through all of this I saw your card and immediately thought of Sisler, only to scroll a bit further and see Jeff suggesting that. I think I've seen a photo of that follow through, and my recollection is that it was Sisler.

Great stuff, guys.

[fkw]

Luis Firpo (boxer)
began his boxing career in So America in 1917, 2nd bout was 1918 in So Amer., 6 more wins in So. Amer in 1919
(Im far from a boxing expert) it doesnt look like he was "Huge" until 1922/23
fought Jack Dempsey at New York 9/1923

Benny Leonard (boxer) held the World Lightweight Championship from May 28, 1917 to January 15, 1925