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Old 01-18-2011, 10:29 AM
Kenny Cole Kenny Cole is offline
Kenny Cole
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Norman, OK
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Todd,

I'm not necessarily advocating Maz for the HOF. I don't know whether he belongs or not. I suppose the answer to that question depends in large part upon how you view the value of defense in baseball. In that regard, it seems rather clear to me that, at least historically, the HOF voters didn't put much of a premium on defense. They were much more moved by the big hitters. Kiner was a terrible defensive outfielder and my 9 year old probably has a better arm than Kiner ever did. Kiner was, to be kind, a defensive liabilty. He also had a short career. However, he got in because of the monster numbers he put up during tha short career. I don't have a big problem with that.

However, Kiner is proof that gaudy offensive numbers are what get a position player into the Hall. Great defense has never been the stepping stone to immortality. IMO, that's a large part of the reason why Maz got no love from the BBWAA. The things he was really good at weren't the things they cared about. That's the whole point about the Ozzie/Maz comparison. For some reason, its different for Ozzie. Why is that?

If you look at Ozzie's offensive numbers, he hit .262, had an OBP of .337, averaged 2 HR a year, and drove in 50 rbis a year. He stole a lot of bases in an era when lots of people stole a lot of bases. Although he scored a fair number of runs, he is comfortably outside of the top 100 in that category. Maz' had more pop, drove in more runs per year, scored a lot fewer runs, had a .299 OBP, and didn't steal bases in an era when no one besides Maury Wills stole bases. I don't think either one of them has a reasonable case for the Hall if you look only at their offensive performances.

The thing that put Ozzie over the top was, obviously, his defense. It was sterling, remarkable, awesome, whatever adjective you want to use. The Cardinals were on TV alot so his wonderful defense was often on display and often seen by a lot of people. That wasn't ever true for Maz. In fact, I sort of wonder if Ozzie would have been a first ballot HOFer had he stayed a Padre and lost all that face time on TV.

Defense got Ozzie in. However, at least if you believe what the numbers say, Maz was in Ozzie's class as a defender. No one ever seems to consider that when they talk about how bad a choice for the Hall Maz is. Why is Ozzie a first ballot HOFer based on his defense while Maz, who was equally adept, should have to pay to get in? Since it was great defense that got both of them in, I frankly don't understand why they are treated so disparately.
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