Pat Gillick Elected

[M's_Fan]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

GM for three WS winning teams gets you into the HOF?

and GM for the 2001 Mariners, that won more games than any other team except the 1906 Cubs. The body of his work is impressive, but I admit I'm not sure how to compare him to others. Comparing GM's is inherently problematic, come to think of it. Does anyone care about the non-players anyway?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by M's_Fan

and GM for the 2001 Mariners, that won more games than any other team except the 1906 Cubs. The body of his work is impressive, but I admit I'm not sure how to compare him to others. Comparing GM's is inherently problematic, come to think of it. Does anyone care about the non-players anyway?

If someone made an exceptional contribution to the fabric of the game, like a Marvin Miller, I can see it and have no issue with it. But it's a slippery slope at the general manager level, I agree.

[triwak]

Glad you posted this Phil, as I was gonna contact you about ANY potential Gillick cards. Damn, the only guy on the ballot that there is probably nothing available of! Being a HOF collector (and trying to obtain even non-players) can be a beeeyotch sometimes! But it keeps life interesting... Lemme know if you find anything, and I'll do the same.

[rhettyeakley]

Good for Gillick, but IMO there are too many non-players/managers that are being enshrined into the HOF. Maybe I'm in the minority but I really don't want Marvin Miller to get into the Baseball HOF--he was a labor leader. Sure, he had an impact on the game (positive or negaive--depending on which camp you are in) but he didn't play, have any direct impact on any game outcomes and shouldn't get in. I know there are other people you could say the same thing about (Kuhn, Bulkeley, umpires, etc., etc.) but just because mistakes have been made in the past doesn't mean we should keep making them.

Also, I'm not a big fan of GM's getting inducted because now you gotta go back in history and induct the 8-10 GM's that were at least as successful as Gillick--not a fan of that ever happening.

Before you know it there will be a call for Bill James to be inducted because of his statistical analysis and how it has impacted the game!

-Rhett

[Rob D.]

Originally Posted by rhettyeakley

Before you know it there will be a call for Bill James to be inducted because of his statistical analysis and how it has impacted the game!

This absolutely will happen in our lifetime, imo.

[rhettyeakley]

Rob, I agree it will probably happen in our lifetime, BUT I don't want it to happen. Regardless of whether it has revolutionized the way we interpret statistics or not.

IMO Broadcasters, GM's, Umpires, Commissioners, Labor Leaders, Satisticians, etc. should not be located in the same HOF as the ballplayers and Managers. Maybe a seperate wing within the HOF but not members on par with the actual participants in the game. I know most will disagree with my take but I accept that.
-Rhett

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by rhettyeakley

Rob, I agree it will probably happen in our lifetime, BUT I don't want it to happen. Regardless of whether it has revolutionized the way we interpret statistics or not.

IMO Broadcasters, GM's, Umpires, Commissioners, Labor Leaders, Satisticians, etc. should not be located in the same HOF as the ballplayers and Managers. Maybe a seperate wing within the HOF but not members on par with the actual participants in the game. I know most will disagree with my take but I accept that.
-Rhett

Aren't most of them technically in a separate wing? Thought was the case already, could be wrong about that though and too lazy to look it up!

[drc]

Just because someone makes an impact, doesn't make it a good impact.

[bh3443]

Maybe I'm in the minority but I really don't want Marvin Miller to get into the Baseball HOF--he was a labor leader. Sure, he had an impact on the game (positive or negaive--depending on which camp you are in) but he didn't play, have any direct impact on any game outcomes and shouldn't get in.

Very well put, Rhett. You hit the Miller situation perfectly.
Not one single player got in?

[DixieBaseball]

Rhett - I absolutely concur with everything you said... I only collect HOF Players and Managers for the very reasons you mentioned. Not collecting the others is my personal protest to the watered down nature of Cooperstown. I am getting where I can't seriously call it a Hall of Fame anymore. With this GM election, I will now refer to the Hall of Fame as simply The Hall or Cooperstown going forward. Totally getting watered down with popular vote, etc.

[Mollys Dad]

Bottom line, baseball is a sport. As such, a-t-h-l-e-t-e-s should be enshrined there. Those with the strength, talent and determination to rise above their peers. Honor the suits, but don't induct them. IMO. I never even heard of this guy until a few days ago. So the word Fame, may not be suitable here.