Veterans Committee 12 finalists

[mr2686]

I was going to ask if anyone had an opinion on Garvey. I'm a little partial having been born and raised in Los Angeles. When I think of Garvey it's natural for me to compare him to Perez and Cepeda. Perez and Cepeda had more homeruns, Perez had more RBI's, but Garvey compares to Cepeda in BA, both have an MVP, Garvey let the league in hits a couple of times, All star MVP twice (for what it's worth) and Garvey has 4 gold gloves and much better post season numbers.

[bigtrain]

I was never a big Garvey fan but he got quite a lot of support from the baseball writers, over 40% a few times. I don't think that Rusty Staub would be a good choice but Garvey and most of the others are borderline guys. It wouldn't offend me if they got in. After all, its the Hall of Fame not the Hall of Immortals. It hasn't been that since the 1940s. No point raising the standards now.

[D. Bergin]

Garvey was a Superstar during his heyday, probably the most important player on a solid run of Dodgers teams, and if you were around during his prime you would have thought this guy was a solid 1st ballot HOF'er.

He became a victim of the stat guys after he retired. His sin was that he didn't walk enough. Didn't really matter what kind of a leader he was, how tough a ballplayer he was, how important he was to his team, that he had 6 200 hit seasons, an MVP under his belt, 4 Gold Gloves and was a beast in the Post-season.

Nope. Just tell us what his OBP was.

[Frank A]

Screw Miller, he should never be in the hall of fame. Martin shoud get in though. Frank

[autograf]

Miller, Steinbrenner have to go in. Regardless of how you feel about them, they changed the game. Maybe not for the better in some people's eyes but they are huge BB figures. Seems like Gillick will get in based on his record too. Didn't know much about him. As for the others, Simmons has good numbers but I dont' think of a dominating player when I think of him. I think more of that of Garvey than Simmons and I'm not sure Garvey's got the stuff. Don't know about them. I like Concepcion but he'd be one of those people 5 years from now we'd be talking about shouldn't have gotten in. I'm a HUGE Big Red Machine fan from my childhood so remember him fondly but who's next.....Santo Alcala? I go with Miller, Steinbrenner & Gillick...............

I didn't think Billy Martin till I saw his record stacked against Herzog........maybe him too.......the new name..........

The Hall of Marginally Better than Average
or
The Hall of Coulda Been Worse

[murphusa]

they've watered down the HOF to the point of "who cares". No one on the list deserves to be in the Hall. And there are about 70 people in the Hall who don't belong

[HRBAKER]

IMO Simmons would already be in if he hadn't played at the same time as Bench. Wondering why folks feel George is such a lock? I don't really get too concerned about the non-players, who's in and who's out.

[Exhibitman]

I don't really think any modern owner should be in--they weren't really involved in league-building, creating the game, etc. Executives, definitely, if they made a contribution in one of those areas. Miller is the most important baseball non-player since Branch Rickey, so he should be in any HOF worth a crap.

As for the players listed, the only one I see as even worthy of consideration is Garvey. He was a hell of a player for several years in the 1970s, right there as the #1 or #2 in the league if not the entire game. Does that make him a HOFer? Probably not, but the hall has done worse.

[mjkm90]

Garvey was the best player at his position for years. He was a force on very strong teams, consistent on offence and defence. Kieth Hernandez was the only 1st baseman in his class during the years he played. Garvey should be in there. If Perez had the same numbers he had on the Rangers you wouldn't remember him. Garvey was much stronger on teh eyeball test.

[Griffins]

I find it a travesty that Marvin Miller isn't in yet.
Steinbrenner has no place in the Hall, which means he'll probably be elected.

[prewarsports]

I am sure Steinbrenner and Miller will get in, but when I finally make it back there for a visit and see Steinbrenners plaque, I will point to it and tell my son about what is WRONG with baseball.

[ramram]

Tommy John's gotta get in. Thanks to a surgeon, and maybe a deal with the devil, his name is more famous than all the other guys put together.

Rob M.

[bobbvc]

Miller should be in already and every modern player should have a Buddha style statue of Marv, and rub his belly every time he cashes his paycheck. If any of the others make it, have a hall of really good players and then open a Hall of Fame with 50 players. And to get in, someone else must come out.

[D. Bergin]

I still don't quite get the exclusion attitude.

A good number of the guys on this list are better then many players already in the HOF. Players that have been in the HOF for decades.

It's not like this would be a sudden watering down. It's seems a lot of people want to impose their own strict criteria to an establishment that never held to that criteria to begin with.

Pretty ridiculous calling ballplayers who were Top 5 in their League at their position for the better part of a decade or more as "Just Better Then Average" or "Very Good".

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

I still don't quite get the exclusion attitude.

A good number of the guys on this list are better then many players already in the HOF. Players that have been in the HOF for decades.

It's not like this would be a sudden watering down. It's seems a lot of people want to impose their own strict criteria to an establishment that never held to that criteria to begin with.

Pretty ridiculous calling ballplayers who were Top 5 in their League at their position for the better part of a decade or more as "Just Better Then Average" or "Very Good".

See, now I don't get that idea. To me it is a logical fallacy--the equivalent of telling the traffic cop you should be allowed to speed because everyone else was speeding too. The Veterans' Committee made some highly political, piss poor selections over the years and enshrined some players who were probably not really worthy of the honor. I don't see the logic of making more crappy choices because the VC made crappy choices before. Heck, at this point I would abolish the VC entirely. The idea of the VC was to clear the players from 75 years of baseball history when the HOF started. It's been long enough to clear the backlog of worthy players. All of the guys on this VC list as players had their chances in the regular eligibility votes.

[thekingofclout]

Originally Posted by Griffins

I find it a travesty that Marvin Miller isn't in yet.
Steinbrenner has no place in the Hall, which means he'll probably be elected.

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