Shoeless Joe Jax DIVERSION, why isn't he in any 1911-1917 major T or E-card sets ?

[botn]

Just found it! Item 43b under Article 29, (section relating to Conduct) of the Rules and Regulations which governs Net 54, does state that all users must agree with any thought put forward by Ted even if the idea is considered reaching. Had I not seen it with my own eyes I would not have believed it.

Yeah I thought Tim, as well as you Peter, made some valid points and raised valid questions. That is the purpose of the board right--to share ideas and thoughts. Or are we all supposed to be of one mind?

[teetwoohsix]

Ted, I'm having a hard time wrapping my brain around the Cobb/Hindu question you've presented. If I understand correctly, your theory leans toward Factory 649 (producers of Hindu brand) being prejudiced against Cobb for being from the South, correct? If this is what you are suggesting, it makes no sense to me.

Encyclopedia of Baseball Cards Vol.3-Lew Lipset (I know I quote out of this book alot, because I read it alot and it is my favorite book):

"In August of 1909, a New Orleans daily ran an ad for "Hindu Cigarettes".The ad showed a drawing of a package of Hindu cigarettes with the top of two cards visible in the top of the package.Both cards,Dooin and Waddell,were major leaguers from the 150 series.The observation here was that it tied Hindu closely to the 150 series.

Less than a month later,the same New Orleans newspaper ran another ad for "Hindu".This time the ad said there were "2 Pictures of Southern League Players in Every Box".The ad showed illustrations of Southern Leaguers,Carey and Bernhard,and if these cards were ready in September of 1909 it certainly removes 1910 as the date for the 350 series.It's possible that only the Southern Series was available at this time,and only with the difficult Hindu Brand."

So,to me,it sounds like Hindu advertised in a New Orleans paper promoting players that were from the South........why would they be prejudiced towards Cobb? I don't get it.

Please feel free to straighten me out on this,if I'm not following correctly.

Thanks,Clayton

[tedzan]

Clayton

Regarding the Cobb/HINDU mystery in both the T206 and T205 issues, I don't know if the people at the Rochester, NY
plant were prejudiced towards Ty Cobb for being from the South. But, what is factual is....as popular a figure as Cobb
was in the 1909-1911 era.....he is not found with HINDU advertising backs in either of these two popular BB card sets.
So, I'm asking you....don't you find that very puzzling ?
Especially, since Cobb was printed advertising every tobacco brand in the ATC system in that era. Particularly, the Red
Cobb, which is found with 22 different backs. Including LENOX, SWEET CAP, TOLSTOI (they are Factory #30, New York
City). But, it's no mystery, the people up in upstate New York did not want Cobb inserted in their cigarette packs.

If you are at all interested in checking out the HINDU factory, here is the link to my thread about it......
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...imball+factory


Now, regarding your comments about the HINDU ads. in the Fall of 1909....here's another one with the cards of Jordan,
Breitenstein, and Hickman. Now, this comment of yours is incorrect........"So,to me,it sounds like Hindu advertised in a
New Orleans paper promoting players that were from the South"

ATC was promoting their cigarettes in the South with these premiums that included ballplayers that PLAYED on Southern
teams. The majority of the 48 subjects in the SL series were, actually from Northern and Midwest cities.

And, to clarify your......"and if these cards were ready in September of 1909 it certainly removes 1910 as the date for the
350 series.It's possible that only the Southern Series was available at this time,and only with the difficult Hindu Brand."

Of the 48 cards in the SL series, 34 of them were available in the Fall of 1909. Subsequently, in the Spring of 1910, the
other 14 SL cards were printed with OLD MILL and PIEDMONT 350 backs. Scot Reader refers to this latter group of 14 SL's
as the "350-only" Southern Leaguers.







I hope this answers or clarifies some of the questions you asked. If not we'll try once more.


TED Z

[teetwoohsix]

Ted-

Thanks for explaining this, I do understand now. I was combining players that were from the South with players who played on Southern teams, and now I am clear on what was confusing me.Thank you for straightening me out on that, I do appreciate it.

I also really enjoyed going back through that thread with the link to the Kimball Factory #649.......what a wonderful history lesson!!!


Thanks again, Clayton

[Abravefan11]

Originally Posted by tedzan

ATC was promoting their cigarettes in the South with these premiums that included ballplayers that PLAYED on Southern teams.

TED Z

ATC also managed to get a few "deep south" players in the ads as well. This one includes at least one player from Georigia, Alabama, and South Carolina.

The ad also features the rare Breitenstein reverse negative.

[tedzan]

Check out our HINDU ads....I'd say that mine has the mysterious reverse pix of Breitenstein.






TED Z

[Abravefan11]

Both ads show his card in the pack with the image reversed. The ad I posted also shows his card with the proper orientation.

Another interesting artistic decision.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by botn

Just found it! Item 43b under Article 29, (section relating to Conduct) of the Rules and Regulations which governs Net 54, does state that all users must agree with any thought put forward by Ted even if the idea is considered reaching. Had I not seen it with my own eyes I would not have believed it.

Now that was funny. Personally, I thought this was a pretty good thread though it's not one of my high interest points in collecting. Since it's not at the peak of my interest there will be a rule 43c put forth, stating that no topic can be discussed unless it interests the other moderators or me .