T206 production/printing questions/comments

[bijoem]

Originally Posted by quinnsryche

Has anyone ever seen a "blank front" T card with just the back printed to back up the back printed 1st theory?

I could be mistaken.....
but a while back - I think someone showed an uncut sheet of just 'piedmont' backs. no fronts.

just going by memory though - I could have it wrong.

[Abravefan11]

Wouldn't the wet sheet transfers and other oddities we see be a good indicator that the front and backs were printed in the same place?

Leon's "Warhol" being a great example.

[cfc1909]

Wiltse.jpg

[Abravefan11]

Most wet sheet transfers are front images with a wet back transfer. This doesn't prove they were printed in the same place as it could have happened to a preprinted front at location #2.

Leon's card however has a front image mixed in to the reverse with brands distributed by several different factory numbers leading one to conclude all of the printing was done in one place. IMO

[tedzan]

This debate can be fun......but, we have beaten this subject to the ground over and over again.

We have presented American Lithographic (ALC) ledger notes on the release dates of various Tobacco brand cards.
We have shown many multi-back printings (T206 and Militarymen scrap) that unquestionably indicates that all these
cards were printed in New York at ALC from 1909 to 1919.

Please use the SEARCH function and type in "American Lithographic" and you will get tons of stuff on this subject.


TED Z

[thehoodedcoder]

here is a good question: could one find a wst transfer of a back, without the overstrike on it or has one been found?

kevin

[tedzan]

This is true, a partial uncut sheet of PIEDMONT backs was found some years ago. And, I base my contention that the
backs were printed first on that find.

But, you're our resident printer, isn't it common sense that the ONE color process that T206 backs are was printed first ?

Then, the more complex 6-color process in printing the fronts followed....on the pre-printed sheets (with backs) ? ?


TED Z

[bijoem]

Originally Posted by tedzan

But, you're our resident printer, isn't it common sense that the ONE color process that T206 backs are was printed first ?

Then, the more complex 6-color process in printing the fronts followed....on the pre-printed sheets (with backs) ? ?


TED Z

Ted....

looking at the overall product - (the cards).......
I would say no.

Since the Fronts are common (to a variety of backs) -
I would think it more logical to print the fronts...... and then as you need certain quantities for certain backs, you back up those sheets with the backs.

As far as what is the more difficult part - yes.... the fronts had to be more difficult / but they still had to get done - so I don't see the difficulty as a determining factor as to what went first.

But.... if the pressman had the press setup and running for 'backs' and ran out of front sheets to back up.... precisely because of potential difficulty - I could see the pressman continue to run backs on virgin stock (especially knowing the size of the overall order / more cards would be needed).

Also....
No doubt these cards were printed over multiple press runs, spanning days, weeks, or months, and you could very easily have had it run on many presses at one time (meaning different pressman / different machinery / all in the same shop).

To a point made earlier:
As far as why you may find more cards that have a blank back (as opposed to those that have a blank front).....

In general, I think it more unlikely that a cutter would cut down a sheet of just backs. Realize after the press run - there are other processes - and other eyes and hands that go over the product. I could see someone cutting down sheets of just fronts (for themselves or others) - but I have no idea why sheets of backs would be cut down and saved.

[caramelcard]

"We have shown many multi-back printings (T206 and Militarymen scrap) that unquestionably indicates that all these cards were printed in New York at ALC from 1909 to 1919."

Ted, I'm familiar with T80s. How does this indicate the backs were printed at the ALC?

[caramelcard]

Question for Scot Reader when you get some time:

Can you explain what you mean by this statement from your T206 study?

"The backs of most T206 cards identify the factory where they were produced."

Thanks!

Rob

[caramelcard]

Why would you find more cards with a blank back rather than a blank front?

My opinion:

Because folks would still want to keep a piece of cardboard that still had a baseball player on it.

I don't believe folks would want something with only a tobacco advertisement on it and most were probably not taken home as scrap if they were blank fronts.