T206 Coupon type 1 scarcity level?

[tedzan]

Frank

I respect your expertise a lot; but, we've had this argument before. And, once more I have to differ with you.

The T213-1 cards resemble T206's considerably more so than they do T213-2 and T213-3. For example, the 1910 COUPON cards......

1.....Stylish back design is consistent with the T206's (AB, BL, Cycle, DRUM) that were printed and issued in the Summer/Fall of 1910.

2.....All 68 fronts are consistent with the 350 series cards issued during 1910.

3.....The captions are printed with Brown ink.


T213-2 and T213-3 characteristics that are NOT consistent with 1910 COUPON cards......

1.....They were printed with BLUE ink captions.

2.....T213-2 cards are are found with gloss on their fronts.

3.....T213-3 cards are cut narrower than the 1910 COUPON cards.

4.....Some T213-3 cards have. overprints with Factory #8 on their backs.

Sorry guy, but using the "thinner stock" argument is very weak and smells like a "Louisiana red-herring".


TED Z

[DixieBaseball]

I still find it fascinating that there is not an example higher than Vg-Ex out there. Yes, the issue is paper like, but come on... Surely there are some crisp raw examples stuck in a book somewhere out there... For us to be this far along in the grading game and a Vg-Ex (4) is the highest example, makes me wonder how that compares to Ty Cobb, Brown Old Mill, etc. -- Would you say that all other t206 cards have higher conditions than this type ? Would this be considered the toughest condition card out of the tobacco series ?

[barrysloate]

I also respect Frank's knowledge but I will pose this hypothetical question: what if Coupon never issued any cards past 1910, and series 2 and 3 never existed. What ACC number would Burdick have designated for them?

[rman444]

That's not only hypothetical, it's rhetorical.

[Leon]

I just want to throw in a vote of support for Frank. Way to go Frank...you are my man!! T213-1 = Coupon type 1......just as Burdick said.

[drdduet]

Is Pluto still a planet? Is the cause of GRID/AIDS still unknown?

With increased capacity for knowledge comes reevaluation of any system of classification.

[ValKehl]

T213-1s to be reclassified to T206s so that my nice T213-1 Matty, which I have had for a long time and occasionally put on my trade bait list (I also have a decent McBride for my T213-1 type card), will increase exponentially (sp?) in value!!

To be serious, not being a T206 collector, I have learned much from this thread (and so many other Net 54 threads, as well), which has probably saved me from letting this Matty card go for less than it is worth.
Thanks to all, Val

[tedzan]

In my above post (#31), I have presented six (or 7) arguments that clearly delineate the the rational for classifying the 1910 COUPON
cards as another sub-set of T206's....the 16th brand, if you will.

Besides the major differences stated in Post #31, the subsequent COUPON issues (T213-2 & 3) were issued during the 1914-1919 period.
These two sets were issued well into the post-divesture era of the American Tobacco Company. Far removed from the T206 era (which
included the 1910 COUPON issue).

So, can anyone come up with as many opposing arguments to mine....that will convince most of us that this COUPON set of 68 cards is
not be considered the 16th brand of the T206 set ?

Besides the recurring "flimsy" excuse of the cardboard stock difference.

Anyhow guys, once these cards are in graded plastic, who will know the difference ? ?


T-Rex TED

I don't know anything about this but just from reading this thread and the info in it I think it works much like my business.

When I first started out I rented equiptment to do larger jobs. After a few yrs I have everything I need for my business and then some.

So you have a Company that starts advertising in 1910 (Also is there any docs to support this date) and may have little money to do it with. If they approached the ATC to print their brand on the backs of the 206 style cards they may have chose to supply or buy the cheaper paper stock which inturn would be inferior to the 206 stock of the major companies.

They (ATC?) only have to design a back font and nothing else. The Cycle and Coupon backs are identical in every way except the name. They are the only 2 that match to a T.

But he lies the issue. Is there not Type 2's printed 3-4 yrs later with the exact same poses as the T206's. Maybe the Coupon Company bought the plates from the ATC (or however it got them) at the end of the Cycle run and changed the name only, then abtained a few players (68 right), made a print run that may have not worked all that great due to the card stock, took a few yrs off and relaunched later with a new color font and better paper stock as well as more player poses due to the T206 run being done.

Is there any evidence to support that the Cycle run ended and the Coupon company printed after that. If so the Coupon is not a T206 for sure unless it was printed before the Cycle cards.

Here are pics of the backs of the Type 1 and the Cycle T206. The next 2 are of a HR baker T206 and a Type 2 Coupon Baker.

Like I said previously I don't know the 206's but I think all the clues are there they just need arranged correctly to make the final decision accurate.

DID I WIN ANYTHING