OT: How about those Twins?

[nolemmings]

Morneau went down in September, so there was for all practical purposes nothing to do. More importantly and as noted, Cuddyer moved to first, Kubel to RF and Delmon to left, and all three were absolutely on fire the rest of the season. There can be zero bitch by Twins fans about production after Morneau went down, except of course for those who still somehow believe it is inexcusable for not beating the Yankees.

As I said, Delmon is on the upswing, ending the season very strong. What you see as his YEAR LONG and somehow permanent condition in terms of OPS is in my view the mirage, as he will improve. BTW, his OPS, as poorly as he played for the first half of the season--thereafter sitting for great lengths until Morneau got hurt-- is still comparable to what was done by Josh Hamilton, and was better than Alex Rios, Tigers Carlos Guillen and rookie (albeit older than Delmon) Clete Thomas, Vernon Wells and BJ Upton.

[nolemmings]

I feel like James Carville when people bitch at him about the Clinton years. His response "What is it you didn't like, the peace or the prosperity?".

You whine that they don't pay, yet you complain that they grossly overpaid for Punto. You complain about GM Smith, who in two years won the division once and lost game 163 to get edged out in the other. You still haven't answered my earlier question, so let me rephrase: What player, what free agent, what signing or player move would have made squat's difference in this loss to the Yankees? Sit Punto, who hit over .400? Hire an arm who would have done better than the one run allowed by Blackburn or the two by Pavano? I know, since he got raked Nathan was the one who should never been allowed on the mound; you know, the guy who set the team record for saves. Maybe Kubel should have been benched--he was 1 for 14, no sense playing a guy with a .300 avg and 100 RBI. Could a blown save, a blown call and 17 men left on in Game 2 have had anything to do with it?. Do you really, truly believe that management cost us that series with the Yankees--that we were hopelessly outplayed?

When the Twins win their next crown, the team will not be markedly different than the '87 and '91 squads, you can take that to the bank. In the meantime, keep us apprised of all the studly free agents that always seem to land in Boston, New York, LA and other large markets, never any one of about 20-25 other franchises, and keep convincing yourself that it's all the Pohlad's (and Bill Smith's) fault.

[nolemmings]

BTW, here are a few notes on Ben Revere, the lousy 2007 pick who's worse than Brett Gardner:

# Twins Minor League Player of the Week (May 9-16, 2008)
# Twins Minor League Player of the Month (May 2008)
# Midwest League All-Star (2008)
# Midwest League Mid-season MVP (2008)
# Midwest League Postseason All-Star (2008)
# Midwest League Player of the Year (2008)
# Midwest League Prospect of the Year (2008)
# Baseball America High Class A All-Star (2008)
# Sherry Robertson Award (Twins Minor League Player of the Year) (2008)
# Florida State League Player of the Week (May 11-17, 2009)
# FSL All-Star Selection (2009)
# FSL Post-Season All-Star (2009)

[tbob]

Todd- At 5-9 and 160 lbs. Ben Revere will never be more than a .300 hitter who hits singles and doubles. He is a quick Jason Kubel with no power. Unless he morphs in to Kirby Puckett the Twins will continue to fashion the worst power hitting outfield in MLB. Span, Gomez, Young, Cuddyer and possibly Revere. Revere is also a lefty and Lord knows the Twins need right handed hitting. Morneau, Maurer, Kubel, Span, the core of the team all struggle against good lefties.
Bill Smith is way in over his head. You credit Smith for winning or almost winning the division the last 2 years. I'm sorry to see you have drunk the Kool-Aid. The AL Central was the weakest this year in all of baseball. The players who carried the team the last 2 years were acquired prior to Smith getting the job. You can't give him credit for any of these players. The ones he brought here were disasters until he hit it lucky with Pavano and to some extent, Cabrera.
Yes the Twins are cheap. Yes they did overpay Punto whom I am convinced has a picture somewhere of Gardenhire and a farm animal, that is the only reason he plays. You mention his ALDS batting average. Good for him. What about his hitting barely .200 for most of the season and being ranked DEAD LAST among AL infielders when it comes to all batting categories.
I bet the Yankee pitchers absolutely trembled when they looked in the dugout and saw Casilla, Tolbert, Buscher, Redmond and Morrales on the bench.
Gardo is 2-12 in the post season since 2002. He is the most overrated manager in baseball.

[nolemmings]

I find this particularly laughable "Morneau, Maurer, Kubel, Span, the core of the team all struggle against good lefties."

Mauer hit. 345 against lefties. Span hit .330. Morneau hit higher against lefties than righties. Only Kubel struggled, hitting .243, so I guess you platoon a .300 hitting 28 HR 103 RBI guy. BTW, Cuddyer hit .307 and Young .310 against southpaws so yeah, I can see where we've got no chance there.

Here's what, tbob. I'm gonna cheer for the Twins again next year, and history says they have a better than 50/50 shot of winning their division. I'm then gonna hope and pray they don't leave double-digit guys on base, blow two ninth innings and fall to a lowly ALDS opponent that wins 100+ games. I'll even pray that you get the job as GM, so I know we will be unstoppable.

You, you will start your annual rant about June as to how such a pathetic organization should be allowed to exist, how their manager and GM should be canned, and how anyone with 2 IQ points could guide this team to annual World Series appearances. Along about now, regardless of how far the Twins go in post-season, the rant will re-appear, and, I suppose, if they win it all we will get a shoulda-swept post or something similar. Believe me, watching parts of 120 or so Twins games a year, I can properly be accused of having a biased perspective of things, but when it comes to drinking Kool-Aid, man that's you, not me.

[ChiefBenderForever]

It's very tough to win even if you spend big bucks. Team chemistry is the key and for some reason the Twins seem to gel very good when other teams don't. I think Gardy needs to get some credit for the clubhouse getting along, but at the same time you have to wonder how many careless errors happen if Tom Kelly was running the show. Girardi has done a great job this year keeping his players on the same page, especially with a headcase like Afraud and all the drama he brings. Derek Jeter is the best player born since 1960.

[calvindog]

And Johnny, last year Girardi was nearly run out of town on a rail.

[tbob]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

I find this particularly laughable "Morneau, Maurer, Kubel, Span, the core of the team all struggle against good lefties."

You, you will start your annual rant about June as to how such a pathetic organization should be allowed to exist, how their manager and GM should be canned, and how anyone with 2 IQ points could guide this team to annual World Series appearances. Along about now, regardless of how far the Twins go in post-season, the rant will re-appear, and, I suppose, if they win it all we will get a shoulda-swept post or something similar. Believe me, watching parts of 120 or so Twins games a year, I can properly be accused of having a biased perspective of things, but when it comes to drinking Kool-Aid, man that's you, not me.

Todd, Todd, Todd. My team right or wrong my team, right? I've been a fan of the Twins since 1961, their first year in the Twin Cities. I used to ride my bicycle to the old Met and watch them. I have suffered through more years than almost anyone and finally after 26 years celebrated that championship. The thing is that you can cheer for your team, even live and die with your team, but still criticize things and hope things improve.
I never said most of the things you said, I've never argued for contraction, I've never said they should win the Series every year or even get there regularly. What I do gripe about is the horrible trades and awful free agency pickups our moronic GM has made and yes I do believe I could do better and so could about 95% of the posters on this board who have any modicum of baseball sense.
I watched 155 Twins games this year. I read the Star Tribune and STPPP daily online. I read Baseball America and other publications too. I never claimed to be an expert but I know enough about the team and organization to understand things you can't fathom. Have you checked the ratings for the farm system the last few years and how we have slid from near the top to near the bottom? Have you followed the Red Wings, Rock Cats, Ft. Wayne, etc?
I am glad you find it laughable that I stated that Morneau, Span, Maurer and Kubel struggle against GOOD lefties. The key is GOOD. You can throw out the statistics but whenever the game is on the line and the opposing team needs an out, they trot out a GOOD lefty reliever and our guys are punchless. Granted Maurer can hit about anyone, lefty or righty, but GOOD lefties like CC, Petit, Cliff Lee, etc always gave them fits. You know that.
OK, this is my last Twins post because I am sure most posters here are not Twins fans and we can always take it to email but I always find it interesting in life that people who never criticize a team think they are a "better" fan than someone who offers up his opinions when he sees something which can be improved, changed or removed. Go Twins in 2010!!!

[dwr11]

Originally Posted by tbob

Gardo is 2-12 in the post season since 2002. He is the most overrated manager in baseball.

That might be the funniest quote I have read on here. Gardy is somehow winning with Punto & Tolbert in the lineup on a regular basis and a bullpen of nobodies other than Nathan. If Gardy isn't AL manager of the year something is wrong.

[tbob]

Originally Posted by dwr11

That might be the funniest quote I have read on here. Gardy is somehow winning with Punto & Tolbert in the lineup on a regular basis and a bullpen of nobodies other than Nathan. If Gardy isn't AL manager of the year something is wrong.

I didn't say he was the worst manager in baseball, I said he was the most overrated. The key is that the Central Division is the worst division in baseball. Cleveland and Kansas City are horrible, Minnesota, Detroit and Chicago are the epitome of average. Someone has to win the division. If the Twins were in the east they would have finished 5th behind NY, Boston, Toronto and Tampa Bay. Luckily we get to play KC and Cleveland and the others so often we can usually manage to get above .500 and get in the playoffs where we have fallen flat on our faces 12 of the last 14 times.

[sagard]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

....You complain about GM Smith, who in two years won the division once and lost game 163 to get edged out in the other....

Smith single handedly cost them the division in '08 and almost cost them the division this year. Wouldn't it have been fun to be in the AL playoffs in '08 with Santana on the hill? No A-Rod waiting to crush us.

This year Delmon/Punto/Gomez did their very best to keep us out for five months.

Gardy manages the team VERY well over the course of a season. He needs to work a bit in game situations. He can't let Gomez take that AB in the 11th during Game 2.

Smith needs to sign Mauer now.