Question about T-213's

gabrinus · #1 07-10-2009, 09:22 PM

Bob, I am like you on Lousiana. It has had more obscure sets than any other state yet I had zero luck talking to dealers from there. There maybe some great collection stuck in an attic or an antique shop, but then you have to think about what Katrina did. Are there any collectors/dealers on the board from Louisiana??

DixieBaseball · #2 07-11-2009, 12:42 PM

Ted - I would love to see this card as well... Hope to catch up with you at the National... I know the raw Type 1's I have are thin, but now I want to go crack open the one's in plastic to see if there is any variation... (I will mull that over for awhile) If that is a one off card, let the speculation begin on how, why, who, and what... Very interesting... Question for the experts.... Help me connect the dots... Were most, or all Tobacco cards produced at the same location (N.Y.), then shipped to these factories for packing, etc. ? How many different locations produced the T cards ? Would it have been simply a error when producing the T213-1, where by a sheet was made with the thicker card stock from one of the other La. brands, then shipped to factories for packing with cig's, etc. ?? I can see where if all of the (see below) brands were being produced there was a variety of different card stock. We know that T213-1 and T211's were being produced around the same time, right !? Their thickness is different, but they were sent to the same factory number 3 in La.

- Factory No. 3 (La.) - T211, T213-1,2,3 (red sun, coupon)
- Factory No. 4 (La.) - T216 (kotton,mino)
- Factory No. 8 (La.) - T214,T213-3 Overprint (coupon,virgina extra)
- Factory No. 10 (N.J.) - T215 (red cross)
- Factory No. 11 (La.) - T216 (kotton mild and sweet)

This Cobb card of Ted's possibly gives more insight into the process back in the day, with all these different type's, as we know there was not just 3 types with Coupon (diffent thickness,glossy,dull,blue ink) but also differnt types for the Kotton, Mino, and Red Cross Cig's as well...

Very interesting Ted - How bout a measurement !?

DixieBaseball · #3 07-11-2009, 12:52 PM

Bob - Tell me about the Victory find... I have not heard about that and was just curious as to when that was, how many, etc.

It is interesting that there have not been any major Red Sun, Kotton, Mino, Coupon, Red Cross finds from someone that strictly smoked those brands, happen to keep the cards, tossed them in a box, and at the very least possibly found, put away again.

I have to believe that there will be something yielded with significance at some point in the future.

Any one up for a Road Trip ?! (I wish I had a week to dedicate to such a venture, as I would go ahead and "troll" as you mentioned the antique shops, area's around the factory, old stores, etc.) Put that one on the to do list, and catch a little minor league ball in the process...

Interesting stuff guys -

Donavon · #4 07-19-2009, 07:04 PM

tbob,

I am in Louisiana and have scoured the state for T213's for about 10 years to no avail except for a lone Type 1 Mathewson which I quickly snagged without quarreling over price. The Mathewson I found came from an antique shop in Kenner, La. which is only about 15 min. from New Orleans. My collection of Coupons has come from various auctions and dealers.....with much difficulty. I believe most of what has been found were sold & moved away long ago. Hope this helps.

Donavon · #5 07-19-2009, 07:13 PM

Bob,

I am in Louisiana and have scoured the state for T213's for about 10 years to no avail except for a lone Type 1 Mathewson which I quickly snagged without quarreling over price. The Mathewson I found came from an antique shop in Kenner, La. which is only about 15 min. from New Orleans. My collection of Coupons has come from various auctions and dealers.....with much difficulty. I believe most of what has been found were sold & moved away long ago.

Jeremy,

Good luck with your venture.....I have been doing this all across the state for 10 years for any of the above mentioned "Louisiana" issues. Other than the one T213 Mathewson & a T213 soft pack (see scan below), I have been able to grab a couple Red Suns out of the state (both boxers) and 4 Tango Eggs issues....all of which were found about 7-8 years ago. With gas prices back up, I just thought I'd warn you before the road trip.

gabrinus · #6 07-19-2009, 09:34 PM

Donavon, I was going to drive down that way a few weeks ago from Arkansas until it hit 100 degrees here. I was not as tempted to drive South when that happened. I may go down in the fall anyway. There is always etouffe' and other attractions in New Orleans.

DixieBaseball · #7 07-20-2009, 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donavon

Jeremy,

Good luck with your venture.....I have been doing this all across the state for 10 years for any of the above mentioned "Louisiana" issues. Other than the one T213 Mathewson & a T213 soft pack (see scan below), I have been able to grab a couple Red Suns out of the state (both boxers) and 4 Tango Eggs issues....all of which were found about 7-8 years ago. With gas prices back up, I just thought I'd warn you before the road trip.

Donavon... Slim pickings, maybe, but that Coupon pack is Incredible ! Do we know if it is from the 1914 era ? Seems kind of wide, but it is the only Coupon pack I have ever seen... Nice !

JJ

canjond · #8 07-20-2009, 07:36 AM

Jeremy,

Coupon packs are extremely scarce. The one pictured above dates to the 1930's so was not actually used in card distribution. I have only seen one original Coupon pack from the correct time period. It belongs to Jim Shaw but is pictured on my website, here:

http://baseballandtobacco.com/t213.htm

DixieBaseball · #9 07-20-2009, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canjond

Jeremy,

Coupon packs are extremely scarce. The one pictured above dates to the 1930's so was not actually used in card distribution. I have only seen one original Coupon pack from the correct time period. It belongs to Jim Shaw but is pictured on my website, here:

http://baseballandtobacco.com/t213.htm

-- I knew I had seen a skinnier, more colorless pack, and after seeing your scan, it came back to me that I saw that pack on your website ! Thanks for keeping me in line !! (Wished I owned that lone pack!) So I need to add that to my Louisana search when I hit the countryside...

Donavon · #10 07-20-2009, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canjond

Jeremy,

Coupon packs are extremely scarce. The one pictured above dates to the 1930's so was not actually used in card distribution. I have only seen one original Coupon pack from the correct time period. It belongs to Jim Shaw but is pictured on my website, here:

http://baseballandtobacco.com/t213.htm

Jon,

I was told 1927 according to the tax stamp. Would that be correct?

Orioles1954 · #11 07-20-2009, 09:27 AM

Last year I picked up a VG-EX T213-1 of Engle for $30 at an antique shop in.......Reno, Nevada! Never know where "mini finds" will happen.

drdduet · #12 07-20-2009, 11:18 AM

Louisiana born and bred here.

The only cards that came out of Katrina's wake were musty smelling 80's and 90's topps, fleer, and donruss.

Over the years I've found hundred's of Coupon's--mainly type II's. I was also party to a Victory find several years ago. A couple of Tango Eggs, some T210's, but mostly T206's. Louisiana issues are TOUGH except for the T213-2's.

Don't bet on any major finds down here as the humidity, heat, and storms have taken the toll on antique paper. I suspect there are more Louisiana issue specimens residing in collections outside Louisiana than there are in attics and closets in Louisiana.

Cut Off, Louisiana (that is, Cut Off as in from the rest of the world)

drdduet · #13 07-20-2009, 11:21 AM

And Ted,

I agree with t213-1 being T206's.

Leon · #14 07-20-2009, 12:50 PM

I have not seen another of these cartons. I think it's close to period...

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