REA reveals a 24 year mystery....the PIEDMONT Plank

[wonkaticket]

The Reccius item was way before T206 just posted as another example.

However the cigars with the Wagner image and bands...is around the same time.

Seems odd don't buy it...seems like a nice spin. Times were simple then but not so that people didn't spin things to cover bigger issues. If you have an issue with kids smoking and your fear is kids will do what their idol does...why endorse smokes of any type???

Sort of like having an issue with adult films and only staring in ones filmed in B&W but boycotting the color ones...

Even years later Wagner's convictions seem to be troubled at best..unless we are to assume he's enjoying beef jerky..mmmm

[Matt]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

Seems odd don't buy it...seems like a nice spin. Times were simple then but not so that people didn't spin things to cover bigger issues. If you have an issue with kids smoking and your fear is kids will do what their idol does...why endorse smokes of any type???

Sort of like having an issue with adult films and only staring in ones filmed in B&W but boycotting the color ones...

Even years later Wagner's convictions seem to be troubled at best..unless we are to assume he's enjoying beef jerky..mmmm

I think we often see that in society - certain things are fine for adults and not for children. I don't think it's hypocritical to endorse a product for adults, but not want children to partake.

I don't think it was an issue of not doing what your idol does, but rather, not wanting them to buy cigarettes to get his T206 card.

[wonkaticket]

Matt agree, but remember the times. Most kids could drink and smoke in those days no problems very few laws like today.

I have a good friend who owns one of Americas oldest printing houses. They have been around since 1885. One of my fav pics in his office is of the factory workers in which there are about 20 kids 10 of which have cigars and or cigarettes in their hands some of these kids can't be over 11yrs old. The shot is dated 1904...right here in PA.

Kids smoked it wasn't that uncommon so Wagners cigars they would have seen as well. And if you're a young boy in PA and you see a Wagner branded cigar....




In fact the newsboy who may have handed out the article above most likely was smoking....

[martyogelvie]

I always felt the story that Wagner didn't want kids to use tobacco was just a piece of urban legend.

[Doug]

If it didn't have to do with money or his opposition to kids smoking is there another theory?

[E93]

Originally Posted by Doug

If it didn't have to do with money or his opposition to kids smoking is there another theory?

There are plenty of other theories; it is just than none have any evidence to support them. To me, a quote with Wagner's own explanation makes it a closed case.
JimB

[E93]

Those photos are very interesting. Those kids all look like tough street kids. It reminds me of street kids in India and Nepal. You often see them smoking too, but you will never find middle class kids who attend school, etc. smoking. I can imagine a similar scenario here in the early part of the last century.

What I am saying is that I would not take those photos as evidence that smoking was widespread among kids. I find Wagner's own explanation of not wanting to contribute to the promotion of childhood smoking to be quite believable.
JimB

[tedzan]

Just as my theory on Plank (American Caramel Co. vs American Litho.), recall that the E91, E90-1 & E90-2 sets depicted Wagner
before T206 did. The founder of ACC, Daniel Lafean was a no-nonsense, enterprising guy who was also an avid BB fan. Do recall
that prior to purchasing ACC from Hershey in 1900, Lafean was the Director of Gettysburg College....Eddie Plank's alma mater.

Add to this mix, Lafean's close relationship with Connie Mack, it doesn't take much imagination to realize that ACC was not going
to give up their exclusive Rights to two of the major BB stars of that era....Plank and Wagner.
I'll add to this theory that the T206 1st series Eddie Collins (with bat) card was never issued due to ACC's control of the Rights
to their A's players.

I still cannot prove this theory of mine; however, this circumstantial evidence is very convincing. Furthermore, It is inferred that
it was Connie Mack's suggestion to Lafean to include BB card premiums with his candy products in early 1908.

To summarize my case here....Wagner was for kids consuming Caramels....he is in virtually in every Candy set from 1903-16


T-Rex TED

[E93]

In many senses, these photos support the idea that Wagner would be concerned about kids smoking. It was happening.
JimB

[Mrc32]

So the question I have as a t205 collector, is do you think the t206 set would be as popular today if Wagner and Plank weren't short prints and were readily available, like a Cobb or a Young are today?

And the one that really gets me drooling is what would the t205 set be like WITH a Wagner and a Plank? I bet more people would collect the gold ones then.