|
#1
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Dennis Mosley
First of all let me say that I am fairly new to this site, and I am by no means an expert on baseball. It is not my intention to ruffle any feathers here. With that said I was wondering why there are so many players in the Hall that do not belong there. I realize there is other factors other than stats such as success of team, mystique of a particular player etc involved here. I believe this applies to all era's of the game from the very beginning till the present. I believe that the Hall should be for only the elite, and that standard Has Not been maintained through the years. I am a big fan of the T-206 set and much as I hate to admit it there are several Hallers within the set that simply Do Not belong in the Hall. I would be intrested to here other folks opinion on this subject as elected Hallers carry a premium price tag as you know. Thanks. Dennis. |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Frank Wakefield
Kirby Puckett |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Danny Grimes
I can actually think of a few players and im sure others off the board can too that belong in the hall of fame who are not currently in. Lets say between 1900-19. Im throwing these up in the air Nap Rucker 200 game winner, Gavvy Cravath? Some of the common players in the t206 set have won batting titles or had some kind of big year(s) |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Anthony S.
Jesse Haines. |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Ed Ivey
Cobb-Speaker, but not either one individually. |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Chris Mc
Phil Rizzuto comes to mind. |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Steve Murray
Elmer Flick. |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Misunderestimated
I know we have done this one before... Anyway, in order of "undeservingness" I would go with: |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Mark
My Top 10... Sorry in advance to anyone that I offend... |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Phil Garry
Ray Schalk |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Todd Schultz
why no love for Kirby Puckett? His numbers look pretty impressive to me, plus being the main cog on 2 World Series Championship teams, and with a half dozen gold gloves and silver sluggers. I can see some thinking it was sympathy that led to WHEN he got in, but I don't see how he doesn't belong. Of contemporary inductees, he's better than Tony Perez, for example. |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Rob D.
|
#13
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Addie_Joss
Whoever said Joe Sewell doesn't belong is beyond wrong. One year the guy was up 500 times in 1932 and only struck out 3 times. |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: barrysloate
Most of them...at least 60%. |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Rob D.
One year the guy was up 500 times in 1932 and only struck out 3 times. |
#16
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Jay
Tommy McCarthy |
#17
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: barrysloate
Jay- your Bid McPhee cards will plummet if you boot him out! |
#18
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: john/z28jd
Jay you apparently dont like defense! If you start badmouthing Omar Vizquel we are brawling |
#19
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Chris Counts
I'm clearly in the minority here, but I believe baseball should simply induct every player that meets the standards of the previous inductees, since that is the only tangible criteria that exists. So instead of kicking out Rabbit Maranville, Bill Mazeroski and others (it will never happen anyway), I advocate putting in Minnie Minoso (who was better than Chick Hafey), Alan Trammell (who was better than Dave Bancroft) and about 100 other guys who were as good as Ray Schalk (Wally Schang was better), Jesse Haines (Lon Warnecke was just as good), etc. Yes, a small, very vocal group of fans would go nuts (I'm expecting to get cursed just for suggesting this), but baseball fans in general would applaud the move and ultimately become more interested in baseball history, especially if a few of their hometown heroes made the grade. It's just what baseball could use right now. With its present bogged down by the steroid scandal, why not celebrate what's best about baseball's past? |
#20
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Anonymous
Todd: |
#21
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: scgaynor
About 30% of them. Alot of these guys got in because they were friends with the right people. A few years ago I asked Yogi Berra (who sat on the committee) who was going to be the next negro league player inducted and he said "Whoever Buck (O'neill) wants". |
#22
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Steve
Too bad Buck didn't ask for himself. |
#23
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Stephen Mitchell
Since the electors have seen fit to add several NON-players to the Hall of Fame this year, if any members were to be eliminated I would suggest Executives and Owners be the first to go. My opening nomination for expulsion would be Judge Landis who singlehandedly helped postpone the integration of baseball. |
#24
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Ken W.
Baseball's Hall is by far and away the most difficult in which to gain enshrinement compared to all the other major sports, from a percentage standpoint. (players inducted/players who have played). I actually believe that the vast majority of HOFers are deserving - probably there are many more unfair omissions. And to whoever above mentioned Dizzy Dean: WTF? |
#25
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Addie_Joss
I said Dizzy Dean. He doesn't belong. The guy only played 5 full seasons. Sure he went 30-7 in 1934 and won the MVP, but Denny McLain went 31-6 and won the MVP in 1968 and isn't in. In his whole career Dean only won 150 games. Not a Hall of Fame career. A very good brief one, but not a HOF one. |
#26
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Jodi Birkholm
I tend to agree with many of your statements. Here are some of my picks, without looking at a list of every enshrinee: |
#27
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Jodi Birkholm
I really should have read everybody's posts before replying. You fellows are correct in your picks. This may be a first--it seems as though I agree with nearly all of you! Tinker and Evers have no place in the Hall, Chance does. Sutter is a joke. I practically feel the same way about Perez, but I also agree with the poster who spoke up for him. If the decision rested solely on my shoulders, Perez would not be in. And whoever said Bulkeley wins the contest for best pick to be booted out of Cooperstown! Kuhn should pack his bags next. |
#28
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: J. McMurry
The fact that Billy Martin is not in is a joke. |
#29
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Jason L
how Kirby gets such short shrift on among those on this Board and elsewhere. |
#30
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: MVSNYC
we have this same conversation about every 4 months on average... |
#31
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Alan
Many of the Sports Halls of Fame induct way too many. The Baseball HOF is no different. I agree with Barry, even 70%. |
#32
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Fred C
Ruth |
#33
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Darren
I like the idea of different categories. For example Ruth = HOF Legend, Foxx = HOF All-Star, Snider = HOF. |
#34
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Jason L
Do you suppose this topic keeps coming up because collectors who focus on HOFers are sick of having to buy cards that they really don't want, because the players actually suck compared to the top tier that they actually WANT to buy? |
#35
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: PC
Let's not forget that hitting stats are not the only factor -- defensive skills count. Also, in the deadball era defense was arguably more valuable than hitting. |
#36
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Jason L
if he's good enough, for long enough, and he changes how a game is played or managed, enough people eventually place a large premium on a guy's fielding prowess. deservedly so. |
#37
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Daniel
Cum Posey |
#38
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Anthony S.
This discussion reminded me of a Bill Simmons article in which he proposed a five tier pyramid style Hall of Fame to accommodate the various levels of ability and achievement of players in the Hall of Fame. It was written a couple of years back, before the slew of steroid revelations, congressional hearings, and Bud Selig reluctantly attending Giants games (during Bonds home run chase) looking as if he'd just eaten 4 bratwursts and been shot with a tranquilizer dart every time Bonds stepped to the plate. |
#39
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Jason L
is by the price of the player's rookie card, in relation to other players of the same era. |
#40
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Wil Jordan
After reading the comments regarding this topic I am even more confused about entrance into the Baseball Hall of Fame. What determines and elite player? Is it longevity, setting records, be a nice guy, play for the yankees? It seems to me that their are many more players that belong in the hall and their are those that need to be kicked out. |
#41
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Alan
Will - |
#42
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Paul
There are so many, but among the worst in my opinion are: |
#43
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: davidcycleback
My opinion is Ozzie Smith was the best fielder (perhaps ever) at a key fielding position, so belongs in the Hall. Comparing his batting numbers to the power numbers of shortstops in the steroids era is not determinant. |
#44
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Mike
The most obvious to me is : Phil Rizzuto. How in the heck did he ever get in ? He had 1588 hits, 38 home runs, 563 rbi's and batted just .273. No power, not a .300 hitter and only 1588 hits !!!!! If he made it , why not just about every other SS. His fielding doesn't look good either ( 247 errors in 11 full seasons or an average of 22.45 errors per year. Fielding pct of .968. This is unbelievable. The hall should have levels: Platinum, Gold, Silver, Bronze. It could be on 4 levels of the building. Platinum would be for Ruth, Cobb, Wagner,Johnson etc. Rizzuto with Cobb is again unbelievable. |
#45
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: howard
While I agree that Rizzuto is one of the weakest of the Hall of Famers it has nothing to do with his defense. Rizzuto was considered an outstanding fielder by his contemporaries and rates as a top SS according to most sabermetric measures. The error totals mentioned were not unusual for the time and Rizzuto's fielding average was well above the league average. Marty Marion is generally considered the greatest fielding SS of the time and his FA was only one point higher than Rizzuto's. Crosstown rival Pee Wee Reese's was only .962. Also, Rizzuto turned many more DPs than those guys. |
#46
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: John Kalafarski
There are 7 non-pitchers who are the gods of baseball: Ruth, Williams, Cobb, Mays, Wagner, Mantle, Dimaggio (I need more research to come up with the gods of pitching, but I suspect that Johnson, Grove, Matty, Grover, Sandy, Pedro would be right up there.). Putting in guys like "No touch" Maz does in no way diminish the very great. By the way, when Diz came along he was the biggest thing in baseball and it was his hard luck to get hurt when he did; longevity is way overrated. If a player is great and gets hurt, he's still great. Tony C was one of those. If you want to get sick over who belongs in the HOF, wait until the steroid guys get in. |
#47
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Frank Wakefield
Ozzie belongs in. Absent the WS play, and him finally getting to .300 for a season, I could see that he'd be borderline. He's not borderline, he should be in. |
#48
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Dave S
John--how in the world can you mention Pedro in the same breath as those other 4? |
#49
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: Mark
I remain surprised that Hafey and Lindstrom are in the Hall of Fame. The other guys can stay as far as I'm concerned. |
#50
|
|||
|
|||
HOFER'S Who Don't Belong
Posted By: John Kalafarski
When healthy, Pedro was the best I've seen. Lower mound, steroid/pro offense era, the gap between his stats and the league's stats was huge, plus I used to watch him from behind the plate at Fenway. Sandy was close, but worked off higher mound, sometimes extra high courtesy of the Dodgers. Plus, dead ball era guys had, well, the dead ball. |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
baseball HOFer's off to ebay | Archive | 1920 to 1949 Baseball cards- B/S/T | 1 | 11-18-2008 07:36 PM |
FS T205 graded HOFer's | Archive | Tobacco (T) cards, except T206 B/S/T | 10 | 05-24-2008 07:32 PM |
The Top 5 Hofer's | Archive | Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions | 58 | 03-14-2007 10:11 PM |
Does this site belong to someone here? | Archive | Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions | 5 | 01-07-2006 05:07 PM |
Finally back down to earth where they belong! | Archive | Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions | 2 | 10-21-2005 12:35 PM |