Thoughts on CGC Grading

[SmokyBurgess]

Not familiar with CGC, but lots of chat if they will gain ground in the grading wars.

Your thoughts.

[gunboat82]

Originally Posted by SmokyBurgess

Not familiar with CGC, but lots of chat if they will gain ground in the grading wars.

Your thoughts.

I personally like CGC a lot. Unfortunately, the ability to resell when needed is a significant factor in grading, and CGC has a very long way to go to catch up in that regard.

A recent anecdote on the relative liquidity: When I needed to sell a lot of cards quickly earlier this year, I had no serious interest in my CGC 1 Mantle at $22K, which was my cost. I had several inquiries on Facebook asking what I was trying to hide by keeping it in a CGC slab.

I crossed the card over to SGC, where it was graded Authentic Altered. It then sold fairly quickly to a flipper for $22.5K. It was promptly listed for $27K, was bought by another flipper, and was then sold to someone who tried to remove the tape to get a numeric grade. It's changed hands five times since I sold it in February.

It's now listed at $33K and will probably be in a PSA slab in the near future. As long as financial considerations drive grading, I think CGC will struggle to gain ground in the sports cards wars. They need big auction houses to start giving them business and hyping them on social media. If that happens, I'm here for it. I've never had a good experience with PSA, and SGC has joined them in the race to the bottom.

[Beercan collector]

Thanks gunboat for that post - very interesting stuff .
Been nice if a collector Could have got it on the cheap instead of a flipper .
Gawd - Whoever removed the tape messed up (IMO)

[Zach Wheat]

I tend to agree with Mike (Gunboat) above about PSA and inferred liquidity / price issues. PSA and the power of the registry...

[gunboat82]

Originally Posted by Beercan collector

Thanks gunboat for that post - very interesting stuff .
Been nice if a collector Could have got it on the cheap instead of a flipper .
Gawd - Whoever removed the tape messed up (IMO)

That's the nature of the beast, I suppose. Once my financial situation was more settled, I tried to get this exact card back but it was out of my price range. The owner removed the tape hoping it would get an SGC 1. Because it didn't, I fully expect someone will try their luck at PSA.

This is all just a long way of saying that I'm thrilled with CGC slabs I've gotten on lower-value cards from Hake's and other places, but they're a huge hindrance when I need to sell because of the stranglehold that PSA and SGC have on the vintage baseball card market. I wish I never needed to worry about value, but the only way I can afford the stuff I want is to sell other stuff. With CGC, I spend all my time fielding questions from people who want assurances that it will cross over to PSA/SGC.

[Exhibitman]

It really depends on the subject. For baseball sure you want to be in PSA or SGC. But step a bit out of the big sports and CGC does pretty well. I know it has not been a hindrance to me. Now that SGC is part of the Evil Empire, I know that some bigger sellers and auctioneers are using CGC. You can see it in the catalogs.

I had a recent very good experience with CGC. Great customer service on a tough esoteric card.

[Dandor]

I have used CSG/CGC a lot in the past. Grading ranged from under $8 to $10 for bulk when I submitted. I sent in a 30 card bulk order recently for about $10 a card and turnaround times are now 80 days for that service. This is not what people want if CGC wants to be successful. If they could have 20 day turnaround times, they would gain traction. This will cause a lot of people to have a horrific experience and not use them again.

They tend to be very lenient on corners, but just as harsh on surface for vintage. Typically 0.5 to 1 grade higher for similar cards. I sent a few cards to also get reholdered since they have slabs designed for most vintage sets now. They also made their holders able to fit slightly oversized cards since they were designed for Pokémon, which don't vary as much in size as sports cards. The stupid crimped back upset me when I got the cards in them.

[Kutcher55]

Great post. It’s interesting that CGC doesn’t hold value even for the most iconic card (or #2) in the hobby. Like most vintage collectors I don’t like the brand but recognize them as “legit” for whatever that’s worth. Many people also want uniformity in their collection and introducing non traditional slabs violates that code, silly as that is. I would have no problem buying a cgc slab and have done so on occasion in the past. But as soon as I have that thing I’m cracking that cardboard out of there. I think there’s one exception, let me double check.

[gunboat82]

Originally Posted by gunboat82

I personally like CGC a lot. Unfortunately, the ability to resell when needed is a significant factor in grading, and CGC has a very long way to go to catch up in that regard.

A recent anecdote on the relative liquidity: When I needed to sell a lot of cards quickly earlier this year, I had no serious interest in my CGC 1 Mantle at $22K, which was my cost. I had several inquiries on Facebook asking what I was trying to hide by keeping it in a CGC slab.

I crossed the card over to SGC, where it was graded Authentic Altered. It then sold fairly quickly to a flipper for $22.5K. It was promptly listed for $27K, was bought by another flipper, and was then sold to someone who tried to remove the tape to get a numeric grade. It's changed hands five times since I sold it in February.

It's now listed at $33K and will probably be in a PSA slab in the near future. As long as financial considerations drive grading, I think CGC will struggle to gain ground in the sports cards wars. They need big auction houses to start giving them business and hyping them on social media. If that happens, I'm here for it. I've never had a good experience with PSA, and SGC has joined them in the race to the bottom.

Well, I would have lost that bet. I assumed this Mantle would be put in a PSA slab before it was sold again, but it popped up on eBay in the same SGC slab. It looks like this is the seventh owner since I crossed it over to SGC about seven months ago.

Again, this is the same card that buyers were passing on at $22K when it was in a CGC 1 slab.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/357659756396

[raulus]

Originally Posted by gunboat82

Well, I would have lost that bet. I assumed this Mantle would be put in a PSA slab before it was sold again, but it popped up on eBay in the same SGC slab. It looks like this is the seventh owner since I crossed it over to SGC about seven months ago.

Again, this is the same card that buyers were passing on at $22K when it was in a CGC 1 slab.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/357659756396

I guess the bow tie really makes the centering pop!

[Gorditadogg]

Originally Posted by raulus

I guess the bow tie really makes the centering pop!

"Amazing centering" lol.

Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk

[ASF123]

You guys laugh, but the centering obsession is ridiculous enough these days that it’s an entirely reasonable thing to say in the listing. (The price, not so much.) Don’t mock the player, mock the game.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by ASF123

You guys laugh, but the centering obsession is ridiculous enough these days that it’s an entirely reasonable thing to say in the listing. (The price, not so much.) Don’t mock the player, mock the game.

Well, I’m not convinced that the slab does much for the centering, so moving it from one slab to the next shouldn’t impact whether the centering premium applies, or to what extent it should apply.

And as an added damning fact, this piece is in such rough shape that I don’t understand why someone would pay a premium for the centering. Just seems like you’re focused on the wrong stuff if you’re paying an elevated price for a card in really rough shape that happens to be moderately well centered.

[jchcollins]

I'm hopeful that CGC can continue to gain footing - even if it's a longshot. The lack of competition in the grading space now that Collectors pretty much runs everything is defeating / not good for the hobby. PSA has been coasting with major issues for years, decades even - and they certainly have no incentive to change anything right now either. Grading as a part of the hobby isn't going away at this point, I'd just be happy if there was the occasional incentive for improvement or push for change that was more than just talk. That doesn't happen with Collectors only steering the ship.

[HittinLikeCarew]

Whoever tried to remove the tape did a horrible job.

[Balticfox]

Originally Posted by gunboat82

I personally like CGC a lot.

Interesting! There's certainly a lot of hatred for CGC on comic boards these days.