Let’s rehash the Bond Bread controversy.

[JUrsaner]

Thank you for posting these John!

[Johnphotoman]

Member butchie_t, did post BCS letters he had and the 24 W571 cards he purchased from BCS, thanks to him we know a lot about the cards BCS offered. The letters from butchie t, were the letters to members to buy the set of Bond Bread cards offered by BCS. We will call them the Original letters.

The letters from member CardPadre were to people who did not purchase the 24 card set. We will call them the second chance letters.

Now member Dave Hornish posted in: 1947 BOND BREAD and its "imposters"....show us your cards? An article from Sports Collectors Digest, by Bob Schulhof, January 22, 1993.

The three posts have formed what I call the smoking-gun. Which I will be posting soon. But first part 3 of Who did find a warehouse with Bond Bread cards in it? Where did BCS get their cards? Thanks for posting. John

[Johnphotoman]

What are we to make of everything said so far? We have solid evidence but not concrete proof that Arrco printed up the cards we call Bond Bread. The facts show us that the set W571- square cut cards were sold to retailers by Arrco, the retailers then use the cards as rewards programs, circa 1940s -1960s. The facts show evidence that a person/collector found some of the W571 sets (squared cut cards), a 24 card set, that Arrco had stored in a warehouse circa 1960s-1970s.

That person was not David Festberg! His story says he found the cards in 1988, and remember nowhere is there evidence that David Festberg told that story himself. I have personally talked to old-timers who say the Festberg story of a warehouse find was made up; Because they knew of a story about a dealer who heard about a stash of cards Arrco had sitting in a warehouse; circa 1960-1970s. This person purchased all the cards in that warehouse; Believed to be from Arrco, 10 to 20 years before the Featberg story. This person’s wife (widow) at his death sold off his collector circa 1980s. Around the time of the Festberg warehouse find. The information we now have suggests that David Festberg and BCS purchased their cards they had for sale from that collector's widow and put them up for sale circa 1988-1990s.

I say concrete evidence because we have people who say they collected these cards (W571) first hand circa 1940s- 1960. And evidence that says the Festberg and BCS cards are the same cards. And we have evidence, although minimal, that Festberg and BCS cards were purchased from a widows collector. And that they are the same cards printed by Arrco circa 1940s. Arrco sold the W571 cards up until the 1960s, when most rewards programs ended by retailers. The cards that were left set in a warehouse until someone discovered them circa 1970s, (the collector and his widow are unknown.)

Does it get any better than first hand knowledge and eyewitness accounts? No! But we still can not say we have 100% absolute proof; Because of people who argued against the proof we have as collectors. These people have given and continue to give their own proof, but as I have proven their proof is suspect and without merit. Therefore we can not say we have 100% proof, but in any court of law, you would get a conviction with the proof given. The facts show us that the people who argue against the proof we now have as collectors, would not stand a chance arguing their case in a court of law. But yet, here we are, and sadly I can not say 100% we have put an end to all the confusion, mayhem, and chaos around the cards we call Bond Bread. The good news is we can say we have at least 90% proof of knowing the truth about the cards we call Bond Bread; With only about 10% of that information is still unclear.

Some of the information that is still unclear: who printed and issued all the different sets we call Bond Bread. The research I have conducted suggest, Arrco was the company that printed all the cards we call Bond Bread, and those cards were distributed by many different methods and companies. There is some inconclusive evidence that suggests otherwise: I should not say evidence, but more a theory that there were other companies that printed some of the cards we call Bond Bread.

One theory is that the 1947 Bond Bread insert cards, and the round and square corner cards of the Sport Star Subject sets and the Screen Star Subject sets were manufactured by the Meyercord Co. of Chicago. I have found no proof that Meyercord Co. of Chicago, had anything to do with printing up trading cards. The facts are simple: the Meyercord Company in Chicago was not a commercial printing company, but rather a company that printed advertising signs and decals.

Not so fast: What about the 1952 Baseball Star-Cal decals set? Yes, the Meyercord company did print the 1952 Star-Cal Decals Basics set; but they were not printed on paper stock as you find with baseball cards, they were decals…not trading cards. These were decals that would adhere to a surface with the addition of water. Meyercord company offered several different ideas for collectors. These could adhere to mirrors, walls, lunch boxes, books, lockers, furniture, trays, lamp shades, and several other items.

While the backs of the packaging explained the concept, it was the actual decals that were the feature. The decals featured all sorts of Major League Baseball Players and the set had various stars. The biggest are Mickey Mantle and Willie Mays, but also found here are Jackie Robinson, Ted Williams, Stan Musial, Yogi Berra, and many more. While most collectors think of the Mick’s 1952 Topps card, his 1952 Star-Cal Decal is much rarer.

Other information that is still unclear- where did the images for all the trading cards come from, and who had the rights to them. Some of the images were from ACME Newspicture Service, others were from Team Photo Packs sold in ballparks and wire photos were even used, some of the cards came from movie studios.

As I was writing up the very pages you just read, I found what could only be called the smoking-gun. At least for the W571 cards we call Bond Bread. At the same time I found the smoking-gun, a post was posted on Net54baseball.com by member CardPadre…that is inline with what I call the smoking-gun. John

Below the 1952 Star-Cal Decals Basics set.

[Johnphotoman]

I call this a living breathing post, (“Let’s rehash the Bond Bread controversy”), for those of you who do not know, I started this post from my notes, and posted what I and others had posted about the cards we call Bond Bread. As new information comes in we can change our minds about what we thought was fact, or new information can be posted that backs up the facts we have.

My post on: “Who did find a warehouse with Bond Bread cards in it? Where did BCS get their cards?” is a perfect example of what I'm talking about as this post being a “living breathing post”.

As I was writing up the post (“Who did find a warehouse with Bond Bread cards in it? Where did BCS get their cards?” ) from my notes on BCS letters from member butchie t - I saw a note I made that said read post #40 from 1947 BOND BREAD and its "imposters"....show us your cards?

The note said: “It has information about who did find a warehouse of Bond Bread cards, it appears it was not David Festberg”. It was a post by member Dave Hornish- he posted an article from Sports Collectors Digest, by Bob Schulhof, January 22, 1993. That post by Hornish, was what I was writing about at the time.

When I read that post…I believed that David Hornish posted the answer to most of the confusion around the square cut cards and Festburg cards we call Bond Bread W571., and the BCS cards. I said to myself this could be the smoking-gun, it has been there all this time.

It just so happened as I was writing about BCS and David Festberg…member CardPadre posted a letter from BCS that I saw as the second part of the smoking-gun. These letters from butchie t, (BCS), the David Hornish Sports Collectors Digest article, and the BCS letters from CardPadre make up what I call the smoking-gun and those three post back up the 3 part post “Who did find a warehouse with Bond Bread cards in it? Where did BCS get their cards?”

How much more proof do we need at this time on the W571 square cut cards? They are circa 1940s and were printed by Arrco in a 48 card set. BCS and David Festberg are the same cards that were printed by Arrco circa1940s. There was a warehouse find, circa 1960-1970s, but not by Festberg. BCS and Festberg did sell a 24 card set of the W571 cards 1988-1990s, but it now appears that they brought their cards from the widow of the person who found the W571 - 24 card set in a warehouse. John

[Johnphotoman]

As I have gathered information and facts on Bond Bread cards, it seems like the controversy could be cleared up. So why after all these years do we still have misinformation and controversy surrounding Bond Bread cards? One answer that was obvious from the posts on Ted Z post; Card set identification was the cause of much confusion. Think about it…How do we as collectors identify cards we collect? Through reference books. Two of the best books we use as collectors for reference; The American Card Catalog and the Standard Catalog of Vintage of Baseball Cards we use to organize our collection has had a hand in that controversy around Bond Bread cards.

(ACC) The American Card Catalog - a reference book that catalogs and organizes American trading cards produced before 1951. Which is considered a classic collectors' guide and is often referred to as the "bible" of card collecting.

The Standard Catalog of Vintage of Baseball Cards, a price guide that provides a comprehensive guide to Baseball cards. Collectors use its many listings as the standard listing for baseball cards. The Standard Catalog of Vintage Baseball Cards, said its own listings rely heavily upon card set identification which originated in the “American Card Catalog”.

Therefore, we can blame some of the confusion on the catalogs and reference books we as collectors use to organize our collection. As I said, two of the main books (The American Card Catalog and the Standard Catalog of Vintage of Baseball Cards), used in collecting trading cards are in part responsible for much of the controversy that has developed around Bond Bread and its cards. Now don’t get me wrong…we could not understand half of what we know without those catalogs. But I and others believe that an update is due in the way those catalogs identify some cards and not just Bond Bread. For us who collect Bond Bread cards, the main question for those catalogs: should cards that were never inserted into loaves of Bond Bread be called Bond Bread cards?

According to The American Card Catalog and the Standard Catalog of Vintage of Baseball Cards, it appears to be yes: It does seem okay to identify cards never inserted into loaves of Bond Bread or issued by Bond Bread to be called Bond Bread cards. But is this the right way to identify cards? Meaning has the two main catalogs really identify all the cards into the right sets. Does new information call for a change as to the way we as collectors want to identify our cards? Yes, I believe we should change some of the card's identification.

Card set identification is one of the most important things we can do as collectors. Using set identification as the guide then we should make changes to how we identify and categorize what we now call “Bond Bread” cards. All the cards we place under the umbrella of Bond Bread should be placed in their proper category. I believe we can now place many of the cards in their own category that would make more sense in identifying those cards.

Understand one problem with set-identification is there are many other similar looking cards from very different issues that are now identified as Bond Bread. However, we can now identify cards previously identified as Bond Bread cards into different sets, or subsets. Many cards are frequently misidentified as "Bond Bread" cards by collectors, leading to debate all because they look the same, (have the same images) or fall under the category used in the American Card Catalog and the Standard Card Catalog of Vintage Baseball Cards as D305/W571 among others.

When it comes to organizing baseball cards, the first step is figuring out how you want to categorize them. Thanks to the American Card Catalog and the Standard Card Catalog of Vintage Baseball Cards it is a little easier. Of course there are many methods to choose from. It truly depends on what you’re collecting, why you’re collecting them and what you want to say about them. For many of us classification of baseball cards is based on the categories found in the American Card Catalog (ACC).

The ACC is known for its categorization of baseball cards, but it also catalogs non-sports cards. The book provides reference numbers for sets, such as D305/W571 for Bond Bread. These reference numbers are still used today. Most of you know, the D reference category classification stands for in The American Card Catalog designation for bakery / bread cards.” And “W” The designation for strip cards / exhibits

Therefore, Bond Bread D305 classification in the American Card Catalog is “Bakery”. Bond Bread W571 in the Standard Card Catalog of Vintage Baseball Cards is designation for strip cards / exhibits. That means according to the two catalogs anyway: Bond Bread cards are either Bakery cards, strip cards or Exhibits.

But we now understand the only true Bond Bread cards are D305,D302 and D301. W571 should be called Arrco cards, (previously Bond Bread). Should we change the way we identify the cards we call Bond Bread? John.

[toppcat]

A point to ponder:

1950 Topps Hopalong Cassidy cards were also inserted into Bond Bread packs as a P.O.S. bonus. I don't believe they are ever referred to as Bond Bread Hoppy's.

Slight note: The last ACC edition of 1960 has cards through 1959 listed, although a lot of things did not make this edition due to some ambivalence among a couple editors about including so many modern sets.

Here's how the CC presented the various Bond Bread sports issues for ease of reference (note the wide range of dates) and the W571 listing:

[Johnphotoman]

Thank you toppcat: A swing and a miss. I totally forgot about Hopalong Cassidy cards. Can you repost the ACC pages? I do not have the dates for W571 pages. Looks like they were cut off. John

[Johnphotoman]

Hopalong Cassidy: I want back over my notes, looking for anything about Hopalong Cassidy; I do not have much. This is because I just did not Investigate these cards, when I began my investigation into Bond Bread, I was looking for baseball cards that matched photos I had. I probably just ignored them although I did buy a couple cards. All I have is there was some kind of cross-promotion between Topps and Bond Bread that put Hopalong Cassidy cards in bread loaves in most states east of the Mississippi circa 1950. Bond Bread issued three 16 subject series of illustrated labels, plus two additional ones, again with 16 subjects in each, using photographs. There were even albums to hold them. I think they would be Classified as D cards , but I can not say, maybe D305. John

[Johnphotoman]

There are three sets of Baseball cards that can be called Bond Bread, D305, issued in loaves of Bond Bread 1947, D302 Jackie Robinson 1947-1950 hand out card, D301 Buffalo Bisons 1958 hand out card, And Hopalong Cassidy 1950 issued in loaves of Bond Bread, set identification is unclear but should be a “D” card. John.

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Johnphotoman

Thank you toppcat: A swing and a miss. I totally forgot about Hopalong Cassidy cards. Can you repost the ACC pages? I do not have the dates for W571 pages. Looks like they were cut off. John

That's the entire listing as it turns out for W571, there's no dates. The straggling line underneath is from another set.

Hoppy Bond Bread pack image attached for fun!

[Johnphotoman]

Originally Posted by toppcat

A point to ponder:

1950 Topps Hopalong Cassidy cards were also inserted into Bond Bread packs as a P.O.S. bonus. I don't believe they are ever referred to as Bond Bread Hoppy's.

Slight note: The last ACC edition of 1960 has cards through 1959 listed, although a lot of things did not make this edition due to some ambivalence among a couple editors about including so many modern sets.

Here's how the CC presented the various Bond Bread sports issues for ease of reference (note the wide range of dates) and the W571 listing:

I am not too familiar with the ACC catalog, what does- Anon (Arrco, Collectors & Traders.... mean?

Is Barney-Berro-Blackwell,Carnero-Cerdon-LaMotto, Gable-Hope-Henis - the names of some of the players in the set? John

[butchie_t]

Ball players, boxers, and actors.

Berra not Berro
Lamatta not Lamatto
Gable…. That Clark dude.

and Bob “For Texaco” Hope

; - )

B.T.

[Johnphotoman]

Thank you Butch. So where do we get, Strip cards and Exhibits cards under "W" cards, if the cards are Ball players, boxers, and actors. John.

[Pat R]

I don't know if it was a promotion in other years but the Hopalong Cassidy cards were included in Bond Bread in the spring/summer of 1952.

Bond Bread Hopalong Cassidy St_Louis_Post_Dispatch_1952_05_25_Page_160.jpg

[Johnphotoman]

Thanks Pat, do you know what they are classified under, "D" cards or under move-stars? John

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Pat R

I don't know if it was a promotion in other years but the Hopalong Cassidy cards were included in Bond Bread in the spring/summer of 1952.

I think that's just the bread end labels.

[Johnphotoman]

Originally Posted by toppcat

I think that's just the bread end labels.

I think you are right. But how about the cards do they get "D" or "W" classification?

[Johnphotoman]

I did some digging into the American Card Catalog, but I am still a bit confused. In the context of the American Card Catalog, "W" designates as strip cards or exhibit cards/postcards. But Jefferson Burdick, the author of the American Card Catalog, originally used this category for "album" cards, which encompassed a broader range. I'm still not sure what that covers.

I look up album cards-"album cards" typically refer to photocards, or small, collectible cards featuring images of the artists, that are randomly included within album packages. So how did “W” get the designates of strip cards, exhibit cards and postcards.

I ask this question because of the Hopalong Cassidy cards. Hopalong Cassidy Bond Bread cards were printed by Topps, not to be confused with Topps Hopalong Cassidy cards: Topps issued their own set of the 1950 Topps Hopalong Cassidy cards. Which had 230 cards in the set and eight print foil cards into their packs. The set is divided into ten different stories. The fronts feature photographs from the show and the backs have descriptions of the episodes. Topps Bond Bread were issued in Bond Bread and had Bond Bread advertising on them.

Anyway, which destination does the Bond Bread cards get, I say “D” because they are Bakery cards. But I have seen them as W cards, which makes no sense. I just do not understand the “W” designation on any cards. This all leads me into my next post. John

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Johnphotoman

I ask this question because of the Hopalong Cassidy cards. Hopalong Cassidy Bond Bread cards were printed by Topps, not to be confused with Topps Hopalong Cassidy cards: Topps issued their own set of the 1950 Topps Hopalong Cassidy cards. Which had 230 cards in the set and eight print foil cards into their packs. The set is divided into ten different stories. The fronts feature photographs from the show and the backs have descriptions of the episodes. Topps Bond Bread were issued in Bond Bread and had Bond Bread advertising on them.

I've never seen anything tying Topps to the larger Bond Bread branded Hoppy's. I have to question if that's accurate, although happy to be proven wrong and I may have confused you with how I posted those ACC images.

Side note-The Topps Hoppy's reissued in those Bond Bread penny packs should just be designated R712-2 IMO, they have no additional markings than those from Topps. W571 does not refer to the Hoppy's at all, I posted that in respect of the smaller B&W 24/48 sports card sets. The Hoppy "Ways of the West" cards are D89 (with two different style fronts, one that takes up the entire bottom quarter of the card with a color Bond Bread ad (-a), then the the one style shown above, which is -b) while Hoppy bread end labels are designated as D290-8. I'm not sure about the sizing of D89 in the ACC, described as 2" x 3". That sizing may have picked up the F278-12 Post Cereal Hoppy's, which were color illustrations on cards near that size. There's also the blank backed color Bond Bread branded Hoppy's with facsimile greetings and autograph, that seem to be PC sized, it seems they were a premium offering. Watson's Non-Sports Bible has these as D126 but that was not a listing n the 1960 ACC and I can't find it in Barker's updates, although I only skimmed them just now. NSB does not show sizes for the non-Topps Bond Hoppy's.

"Modern" cards in the ACC, meaning issued since WW2 ended, were often given short shrift in the ACC as most of the editors had disdain for them and they missed many widely available issues, although Buck Barker's Updates from 1960-72 did a pretty good job of picking up the stragglers and in monitoring contemporary sets.

[Johnphotoman]

Thank you , toppcat. It’s not about being proven wrong, it is about the facts. It is a fact that you have never seen anything tying Topps to the larger Bond Bread branded Hoppy's. But here are the links where I did find the information.

From: Dave's Vintage Non Sports cards!!
“A very early Topps issue, the 1950 Topps Hopalong Cassidy cards features William Boyd! There are 230 cards in the set and eight rare short print foil cards were also inserted randomly into the packs. The set is divided into ten different stories. The fronts feature photographs from the show and the backs have descriptions of the episodes. A very popular Topps issue.”

From: Dean's Cards! 1950 Hopalong Cassidy: “The 1950 Hopalong Cassidy Set contains 230 cards of the popular cinema & TV cowboy, played by William Boyd. The set was issued by Topps, in two-card panels. Each card measures 2 1/16" x 2 5/8" and is perforated on one side. There are also 8 short-printed foil inserts that are not considered part of the standard set. The cards of the 1950 Hopalong Cassidy set tell 10 different stories, which are easily differentiated by the color of the scene.”

From: The Topps Archives!
Then there was the massive cross-promotion between Topps and Bond Bread that put Hoppy cards in bread loaves in most states east of the Mississippi. Bond also had Hoppy bread end labels that had nothing to do with Topps:

https://www.gfg.com/nonsports/hopalongcassidy.shtml

https://www.deanscards.com/c/3488/19...U1ZM2V-PxQSMOU

https://www.thetoppsarchives.com/2023/09/

John

[toppcat]

Topps Archives is my blog, in fact. I'm a little confused still by your wording on the larger cards but no matter, it seems the ACC and NSB are too!

[Johnphotoman]

Yes, I understood - The Topps Archives was your blog, great blog by the way. I was just saying where I did get my information. On the larger cards, I was talking about the cards I have, the blank backed color Bond Bread. I see there would be D126, which measures 3 ¼x5 ½. Question the The Hoppy "Ways of the West" cards that are D89 , were they printed by Toops? I also believe my wording on the larger cards were about the D89 cards. John

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Johnphotoman

Yes, I understood - The Topps Archives was your blog, great blog by the way. I was just saying where I did get my information. On the larger cards, I was talking about the cards I have, the blank backed color Bond Bread. I see there would be D126, which measures 3 ¼x5 ½. Question the The Hoppy "Ways of the West" cards that are D89 , were they printed by Toops? I also believe my wording on the larger cards were about the D89 cards. John

I don't think Topps was involved with Ways of the West. Hoppy was one of the most marketed characters at the time and there were dozens, if not hundreds, of licensed products. I haven't found a source for the D126 classification-can you post it as I'd like to add it to my Hoppy files. As noted, I may have missed in the ACC Updates.

[Johnphotoman]

All I have is the Dean’s Cards listing: The 1950 Hopalong Cassidy Set contains 230 cards of the popular cinema & TV cowboy, played by William Boyd. Which says the cards were issued by Topps, in two-card panels. Each card measures 2 1/16" x 2 5/8" and is perforated on one side D89 sets. Maybe I am wrong.

As for D216, I do not have the actual listing, just what people have told me. It comes from Watson's Non-Sports Bible, which lists the cards I have as D216. See images below. John

The first images are the D216- the Bond Bread cards. The others are from Dean’s Cards- D89 sets issued by Toops.

[Johnphotoman]

I also have this premium printed photo on 20# bond paper that is 7 7/16 x 9 15/16. And stick on decal - I was told they were issued by Topps, but I have no idea if that is true. John

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Johnphotoman

All I have is the Dean’s Cards listing: The 1950 Hopalong Cassidy Set contains 230 cards of the popular cinema & TV cowboy, played by William Boyd. Which says the cards were issued by Topps, in two-card panels. Each card measures 2 1/16" x 2 5/8" and is perforated on one side D89 sets. Maybe I am wrong.

As for D216, I do not have the actual listing, just what people have told me. It comes from Watson's Non-Sports Bible, which lists the cards I have as D216. See images below. John

The first images are the D216- the Bond Bread cards. The others are from Dean’s Cards- D89 sets issued by Toops.

D126-I see the ref in NSB, I think those are the blank-backed premiums. I'm curious where Watson got that ACC number from as the May 1, 1971 Catalog Additions go up to D115, for a set of Federal Sweets Wild Animals and I've not found anything higher in that sequence. Ah, minutiae!

[Johnphotoman]

toppcat, You are right, sometimes it’s the trivial details that can trip us up! It is the finer points, take the D216 cards of Hopalong Cassidy I posted; The facts or details for all intended purposes were printed by Topps, but issued by Bond Bread, thereby they are a “D” cards. On the other hand the “W” cards especially the W571 cards have no connection to Bond Bread, you are right that the W571 cards have nothing to do with Hopalong Cassidy cards. But now and then you will see these cards listed as “W” cards. John

[Johnphotoman]

I guess I should not say Topps did actually print the D216 cards but licensed them to Bond Bread, I do not believe Topps printed cards in the 1950, I believe Topps used Lord Baltimore Press for most of their printing at this time. toppcat, I defer to you about the printing of Topps cards, I know you know a lot more about this than me. I remember seeing your post, about Printing of Topps Cards Pre-1965. John

[Johnphotoman]

Forget the "Lone Ranger" cards: Bond Bread did include "Lone Ranger" cards in their bread packaging as part of a promotional campaign. Bond Bread, launched a promotional campaign in the 1940s that included inserting "Lone Ranger" cards into their bread loaves. "Lone Ranger" Cards: featured images and information about the popular radio and television character, The Lone Ranger, and his sidekick, Tonto. I do not know how these cards are classified, but should be "D" cards. Images are from 1997. John

[Pat R]

January 15 1989 New Jersey newpaper clipping.

Bond Bread Warehouse find The_Record_1989_01_15_211.jpg

[Johnphotoman]

Thank you Pat R, great work as usual. The BCS letter from butchie_t and
CardPadre and now this newspaper clipping sure proves Staley Apfelbaum, president of BCS, was a hustler and a conman. Although he was good at persuading people into believing something that is not true, there is good news for people who brought cards from BCS:

You can trust that what you have are not fake, he may have tricked you into buying the cards for more money than the cards were worth at the time. That's the con, or deception; That was the hustler in him. Yes he did embellish the truth about the cards, even to the point where he changed his own story to hustler and con people into buying cards from BCS.

The good news is most of his story is true, as I said, he embellished the truth. Stop and think, all good conman use the truth to deceive. I look at it like this; it is like buying a car, the salesman told you white lies to sell you a car, all to get you to pay more money then you could have paid somewhere else, the car is still the same car, you just paid more money then you could have.

Comparing the letters from BCS and the newspaper clipping facts:

All three say the cards are from 1947, we have proof of this, in fact they could have been out circa 1940s.
The cards offered were the ones we call Bond Bread W571, square corned cards type.
The cards were found in a warehouse, yes that is true.
The widow of the person who found the cards put them up for sale circa 1980s. Yes, this is true.
In the warehouse find, there were 48 cards to a set.
BCS only sold half the sets, a 24 card set.

Not a fact- Apfelbaum only saw one complete set, and that set was piece together. There were many complete sets around.
Not a fact-the cards were included in every loaves of bread, the square cut cards were never put in Bond Bread, in fact have nothing to do with Bond Bread.
Apfelbaum said: it was a Real estate broker who found the cards, who owned a former Bond Bread Warehouse, near the Brooklyn Waterfront.
Apfelbaum said: a real estate agent came across the cards and brought them all, notice this person came across the cards, he did not own a warehouse that once belonged to Bond Bread.
Apfelbaum said: A famous collector discovered the cards in a warehouse, and snatched up all the cards.

The joke is on Apfelbaum, because you brought the W571 cards from him, you own a piece of baseball history, and you have a story to tell how you received your cards. I would be more than happy to have brought cards from BCS. If you were one of the people who keep these cards my hat goes off to you. You have what many of us, cannot, yes we can own the W571 cards but not from BCS, that have their own baseball history along with general baseball card history from the W571 card set. John

[toppcat]

This thread is pretty amazing. I just went back to make sure I hadn't posted this SCD Jan 22 1993 article before, so here it is.

[Johnphotoman]

Thank you Toppcat, you did post it in Ted Z thread. As anyone can see the article backs up the proof that has been given for the square cut W571 cards in this thread. I tried to post it, but it was to big or you could not read it, Thank you again it is a great post. I tried to post it in post #186, if you miss that post you should go back and read it. From that post on, most of the posts are tied to the Sports Collectors Digest article. John

[Johnphotoman]

Lone Ranger and Bond Bread.
I did a little more digging into the Lone Ranger and Bond Bread. I posted that Bond Bread did include Lone Ranger trading cards into their loaves of bread circa 1940s. I had stated - that I did not know how they were classified, or if they were even classified, but believed they would be “D” cards. I posted this because I had a note; “should the Lone Ranger cards be called Bond Breads? Since they were issued by Bond Bread, it would seem to be a yes, and they should be classified as “D” cards since they were Bakery cards.”

All I had to go on was: My note; Bond Bread, launched a promotional campaign in the 1940s that included inserting "Lone Ranger" cards into their bread loaves. "Lone Ranger" Cards: featured images and information about the popular radio and television character, The Lone Ranger, and his sidekick, Tonto. I believe someone had told me that Lone Ranger cards were inserted into the loaves of Bond Bread. But the only trading cards I found were not from the 1940s, but 1997 from Dart FlipCards Inc. promoting Bond Bread., I believe these are reprints of the originals.

Does anyone have more information on Lone Ranger cards insured in the loaves of Bond Bread. I did find cards distributed by Gum Inc. R83-1, circa 1930-1940s. And Lone Ranger Premiums (R83-2) by Gum Inc. But no cards from Bond Bread. But at the same time Bond Bread was associated with "The Lone Ranger" through advertising campaigns, including a "Lone Ranger Safety Club" and promotional items like pinback badges, as well as a vintage enamel sign. Which have nothing to do with trading cards.

My question…did Bond Bread actually put Lone Ranger trading cards in their bread? Or even given them out as a rewards program- handouts? If not, why would we have reprints by Dart FlipCards? (see images above). In 1997 the Dart Flipcards printed the cards the same year Bond Bread went out of business. I would assume that Bond Bread had them issued. In 1979, Bond Baking Company declared bankruptcy and ceased operations, so would Bond Bread be reissuing Lone Ranger cards, if they did? If they are reissued cards, where are the originals? John.

[Johnphotoman]

I asked this question back in 2021; is it Bond Bread or Bond Homogenize Bread. This was around the time I joined net54baseball,com. Now, I had been reading the forum since around 2010. But I joined so I could ask questions about all the cards we call Bond Bread.

It is the trivial details that can trip us up! Most of the responding posts said, see Ted Z post. The trivial details: I was already reading Ted Z post, that's why I wanted to ask the question. And why I ask it on a separate thread.

My thought process was maybe that’s a way we could tell all the many so-called cards we call Bond Bread apart. Maybe the round corner cards were Homogenized Bond Bread and all the other cards were just Bond Bread. After all Ted Z did call the round corned cards -Homogenized Bond Bread - at least saying they came in Homogenized Bond Bread packages. Many others called the square corner cards Bond Bread (W571) and did not use the term Homogenised Bread.

Since then I have done some digging on my own into the name's Bond Bread and Homogenized Bond Bread. The facts may be a little fuzzy, if you have more information please post.

Bond Bread was a product of General Baking Company. The idea for Bond Bread came from William Deininger, president of General Baking Company at the time the company was producing bread under the name "Superior Bread"

The name Bond Bread comes from the term bond, meaning 'a promise or guarantee of repayment of debt'. The company used the name as a way to say its purity of ingredients were guaranteed like it was home-made bread. (From Wikipedia).

William Deininger, president of General Baking Company, chose the name "Bond Bread" to signify a "bond" or pledge of high-quality ingredients, and the company also promoted the bread as "homogenized" for freshness and longer shelf life. Over the years the company grew through mergers with local area bakeries. By the 1930’s the company became one of the largest bread suppliers in the country producing 1.5 million loaves per day. At the time it was even more popular than Continental Baking’s well-known brand Wonder Bread.

Which begs the question, how many trading cards of the D305 did Bond Bread produce and put inside their Homogenize Bread packages? I used to think it was not that many, but 1.5 million a day. That's a lot of bread loaves to put cards into! Now I understand they did not put trading cards in every loaf of bread made per-day, but ⅓ per-day for 6 months will still be more cards than I believed were printed, POP. That would be 3 million total cards, 48 cards to a set would be sixty-two thousand five hundred sets.

The General Baking Company adopted the name Bond as a way to say the purity of its ingredients were guaranteed just as if it was homemade bread. They also claimed their bread was homogenized which they promoted as making their bread fresher and longer lasting.

Here is where it gets a little fuzzy, I believe the General Banking Company started using the name Homogenize Bread after William Deininger held a national recipe contest in 1915 to award the housewives who sent him the best recipes for bread. He received more than 45,000 responses. He began calling the bread Homogenized, like it was homemade. Most homemade bread recipes sent in, used milk that has been homogenized, a process that breaks down fat globules to prevent cream separation, resulting in a smoother texture and potentially easier digestion for some.

My conclusion: I believe the only two cards they should be called Homogenize Bread are D305 and D302- they seem to be the only cards associated with Homogenize Bread. We can not say all “D” cards are Homogenize Bread cards. Just like we cannot say the W571 cards are Bond Bread. Therefore we cannot use Homogenize Bread or Bond Bread to separate the cards into set “D” or “W” sets, but we can use the terms to describe a particular set of “D” or “W” cards. Like saying: D305 Homogenize Bread. We should say the W571 cards are Arrco squared cut cards previously called Bond Bread and then we can say the Buffalo Bisons D301 are Bond Bread cards. John

[Pat R]

Hi John, my friend brought his cards over a couple of days ago so I could look at them again.

One thing that I hadn't noticed the first time was how much they vary in size.

They don't fluoresce under black light so the paper is pre 1950.

The Pafko measures 2 5/16 by between 3 1/2 and 3 9/16
The Sain measures 2 3/16 by a hair bigger than 3 9/16

img736.jpgimg737.jpg

[Johnphotoman]

Thank you Pat: Yes, it is a common theme for the Bond Bread cards to be of different sizes. The different sizes of the "Bond Bread" cards likely stem from variations in the printing and cutting processes. It appears they came out at the same time, except for the obvious fakes. The cards we call Bond Bread- includes various card types, including movie stars, baseball players, boxers, and western stars, some of which might have unique sizes or back designs, the various cards could be another reason for the different sizes. John

[Johnphotoman]

I remember when I was in High School, in my printing class- we had a Guillotine- cutter - (no power)- it had a tape measure band, you would move this band to the size, sometimes the band would be off the true size. My first job in printing had to have the cutters calibrated every now and then, and we had two, but they did not cut the same size, its like using a tape measure, they can measure differently; that why you use the same tape measure on precise work, because one could give you a different size. John

[Pat R]

Originally Posted by Johnphotoman

I remember when I was in High School, in my printing class- we had a Guillotine- cutter - (no power)- it had a tape measure band, you would move this band to the size, sometimes the band would be off the true size. My first job in printing had to have the cutters calibrated every now and then, and we had two, but they did not cut the same size, its like using a tape measure, they can measure differently; that why you use the same tape measure on precise work, because one could give you a different size. John

Yes a ruler is more accurate than a tape measure. When I mark out my chaulk lines for my tile work I use the 1 inch mark because the ends of a tape measure can get bent or be loose.

[Johnphotoman]

Originally Posted by Pat R

Yes a ruler is more accurate than a tape measure. When I mark out my chaulk lines for my tile work I use the 1 inch mark because the ends of a tape measure can get bent or be loose.

Yes, a great way to put it, the cutting of the cards is the same and why there are different sizes. John

[Johnphotoman]

I started looking into Bond Bread cards, because of photos, I have.
Now I have come full circle. The photos I have may help explain the Bond Bread cards.

I was of the opinion that Arrco had the license on the images on the cards. If not had the original negatives on all the cards we call Bond Bread. Bond Bread most likely printed all the cards we call Bond Bread. But they only had a license to do so.

New information suggest a company called the National Sports photo company, had all the rights and original negatives to all the images on the cards we call Bond Bread.
See the links- for the information on this new information. John.

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=359672

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=359423

I misspoke, Bond Bread did not print all the cards we call Bond Bread, information suggests Arrco was the company that printed the many cards (varieties) we call Bond Bread. John