Paul Skenes Superfractor Ends in Goldin

bnorth · #1 07-19-2024, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

What's crazy about Randy Johnson, is nobody would have ever "invested" in him to begin with.

He was an unheralded 2nd round pick with a mediocre minor league career. A live arm for sure, but with really bad control issues.

His first several years as a starter he struck out a ton of guys, but had a horrible problems with Walks, and sported some atrocious WHIP numbers.

The same could be said of Nolan Ryan, but Nolan came out of it at a much younger age then Randy.

Johnson didn't even begin to become dominating until he was almost 30, which by then "investors" would think it's a complete waste of time putting money into a guy who has to crawl out of a giant statistical hole to one day be considered one of the best pitchers to ever live.

That would be like, all of a sudden, deciding to invest in Cliff Lee Rookie cards in 2008.

Even, with all that said. Considering the numbers he eventually compiled throughout his career. I don't see a lot of general interest in Randy Johnson Rookie cards.

You can't give most Randy Johnson cards away. There are a few 89 Fleer versions that sell for 4 and 5 figures. Not sure why but I never hear of any Randy collectors besides the ones that collect the 89 Fleer error versions.

D. Bergin · #2 07-19-2024, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth

You can't give most Randy Johnson cards away. There are a few 89 Fleer versions that sell for 4 and 5 figures. Not sure why but I never hear of any Randy collectors besides the ones that collect the 89 Fleer error versions.

Out of curiosity I just checked and Randy Johnson Upper Deck Rookies in PSA 10 sell for well under 100 bucks nowadays.

Ken Griffey Jr's card from that set sells for about 2 grand.

Griffey Jr. has 1 MVP and a career 83.8 WAR

Randy Johnson has 5 Cy Youngs and a career 101.1 WAR

Also...and forgive me if I'm perpetuating a myth, wasn't there rumors of monster boxes full of Ken Griffey Jr. Rookies coming out of the Upper Deck factory, separately from it's normal print run?

Now, I'm not saying that Griffey Jr. and Randy Johnson should be on the same playing field, when it comes to this issue, but the discrepancy seems insane to me.

To me, I'd say Randy Johnson was the Nolan Ryan of his era...I'd call Pedro the Sandy Koufax of that era.......but I guess, if anything, it reinforces that collectors/investors don't really care about most pitchers, unless they are present day phenoms.

Skenes looks fantastic so far...but how long until he becomes just the next Bret Saberhagen, Stephen Strasburg......or hell, best case scenario...Randy Johnson?

Peter_Spaeth · #3 07-19-2024, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Out of curiosity I just checked and Randy Johnson Upper Deck Rookies in PSA 10 sell for well under 100 bucks nowadays.

Ken Griffey Jr's card from that set sells for about 2 grand.

Griffey Jr. has 1 MVP and a career 83.8 WAR

Randy Johnson has 5 Cy Youngs and a career 101.1 WAR

Also...and forgive me if I'm perpetuating a myth, wasn't there rumors of monster boxes full of Ken Griffey Jr. Rookies coming out of the Upper Deck factory, separately from it's normal print run?

Now, I'm not saying that Griffey Jr. and Randy Johnson should be on the same playing field, when it comes to this issue, but the discrepancy seems insane to me.

To me, I'd say Randy Johnson was the Nolan Ryan of his era...I'd call Pedro the Sandy Koufax of that era.......but I guess, if anything, it reinforces that collectors/investors don't really care about most pitchers, unless they are present day phenoms.

Skenes looks fantastic so far...but how long until he becomes just the next Bret Saberhagen, Stephen Strasburg......or hell, best case scenario...Randy Johnson?

Nolan and Koufax are very big with collectors, so it's obviously not all pitchers. Johnson just never gained hobby traction, maybe in part it was the teams he played on (Yankees were VERY late), maybe it was his lack of charm, maybe part of it was that he always seemed to be third fiddle to Clemens and Maddux even though that probably was not fair.

packs · #4 07-19-2024, 12:23 PM

Randy does well in the autograph realm. His signed Topps Traded and Tiffany rookies sell.

Exhibitman · #5 07-19-2024, 12:48 PM

Add me to the chorus of those who think Randy Johnson does not get the requisite hobby love for his achievements. In that vein, he reminds me of this guy:

Per Wikipedia: "With 363 career wins, Spahn holds the major league record for a left-handed pitcher and has the most by a pitcher who played his entire career in the post-1920 live-ball era. He was a 17-time All-Star who won 20 games or more in 13 seasons, including a 23–7 win–loss record when he was age 42. Spahn won the 1957 Cy Young Award and was a three-time runner-up during the period when only one award was given for both leagues. At the time of his retirement in 1965, Spahn held the Major League record for career strikeouts by a left-handed pitcher. ... The Warren Spahn Award, given annually to the major leagues' best left-handed pitcher, is named in his honor." And he lost 4 seasons to WWII. Yet when we discuss GOAT LHPs, Spahn (100.1 WAR) usually is not considered in the same breath as Grove (106.8), Randy Johnson (101.1), and Koufax. Why: because speed kills. A crafty guy whose philosophy of pitching was "Hitting is timing. Pitching is upsetting timing," he doesn't capture the fancy the same way as the fireballers do. Plus the coolest wind-up ever.

Peter_Spaeth · #6 07-19-2024, 01:02 PM

"Hitting is Timing. Pitching is upsetting timing."

Carter08 · #7 07-19-2024, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Add me to the chorus of those who think Randy Johnson does not get the requisite hobby love for his achievements. In that vein, he reminds me of this guy:

Per Wikipedia: "With 363 career wins, Spahn holds the major league record for a left-handed pitcher and has the most by a pitcher who played his entire career in the post-1920 live-ball era. He was a 17-time All-Star who won 20 games or more in 13 seasons, including a 23�7 win�loss record when he was age 42. Spahn won the 1957 Cy Young Award and was a three-time runner-up during the period when only one award was given for both leagues. At the time of his retirement in 1965, Spahn held the Major League record for career strikeouts by a left-handed pitcher. ... The Warren Spahn Award, given annually to the major leagues' best left-handed pitcher, is named in his honor." And he lost 4 seasons to WWII. Yet when we discuss GOAT LHPs, Spahn (100.1 WAR) usually is not considered in the same breath as Grove (106.8), Randy Johnson (101.1), and Koufax. Why: because speed kills. A crafty guy whose philosophy of pitching was "Hitting is timing. Pitching is upsetting timing," he doesn't capture the fancy the same way as the fireballers do. Plus the coolest wind-up ever.

Count me in for thinking Spahn is underappreciated.

dealme · #8 07-20-2024, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carter08

Count me in for thinking Spahn is underappreciated.

Agreed�.and that�s just for fighting at the Battle of the Bulge, let alone his on-field achievements.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Snowman · #9 07-21-2024, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carter08

Count me in for thinking Spahn is underappreciated.

Spahn was also the #1 helped-by-park-factors pitcher in MLB history though. Literally #1 on the list across thousands of pitchers. Nobody pitched in a more pitcher friendly park and for longer than Warren Spahn. He's #1 on the list by a large margin too. County Stadium was even more pitcher friendly than Dodger stadium during Koufax's prime.

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