Memory Lane sold cards they didn't have per SCD

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Also, as I understand it from what someone said, if the cards are recovered, and assuming insurance issues can be worked through, the winning bidders still have an option to pay for and receive the cards they "won." Another indicator IMO this was not a "fraud" as I understand the term.

If you simply look at it from the point of view of the house, what did they have to gain by letting the auction go with 54 key lots that at the time the auction ended they could not ship? They were now going to have to tell 54 people, possibly, what happened. What is the upside there?

They allegedly told nobody outside of the company about the theft until the auction was concluded and they very well might not have insurance coverage for this and will be writing a check. Yes disappointing and it sucks to think you can win something that you cannot take possession of but I just see no advantage to them in having done so. It might not be the best look for them but they look awful shipping the box as they did. To me, the rest of it is moot.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Lorewalker

If you simply look at it from the point of view of the house, what did they have to gain by letting the auction go with 54 key lots that at the time the auction ended they could not ship? They were now going to have to tell 54 people, possibly, what happened. What is the upside there?

They allegedly told nobody outside of the company about the theft until the auction was concluded and they very well might not have insurance coverage for this and will be writing a check. Yes disappointing and it sucks to think you can win something that you cannot take possession of but I just see no advantage to them in having done so. It might not be the best look for them but they look awful shipping the box as they did. To me, the rest of it is moot.

What they gain of course is an infinitely easier path to reimburse consignors and deal with insurance issues. Otherwise, it's a hot mess as most of these cards do not have commodity values. Nothing at all sinister about this. Context matters unless you live by a dictionary.

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

What they gain of course is an infinitely easier path to reimburse consignors and deal with insurance issues. Otherwise, it's a hot mess as most of these cards do not have commodity values. Nothing at all sinister about this. Context matters unless you live by a dictionary.

That was my failed attempt at the point. It was done for their consignors. The house does not benefit at all from having done this.

I did raise the question the other day that Ryan and the house had already estimated the values of his consignments. Not sure if all 54 cards stolen were his but there was an agreement as to what they both felt the cards would sell for. I know that estimate prior to consignment being sent is not the same as the auctions having run their course but the house was not in total darkness about what those lots were worth. Turned out they were close to spot on. It begs the question if they really needed to leave the lots in there for valuation purposes.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Lorewalker

It begs the question if they really needed to leave the lots in there for valuation purposes.

I guess the only question in my mind is whether the parties went into it feeling that the estimates were high estimates or low estimates. And whether the parties would have attempted to revisit those original estimates based on no additional information. By letting it run, in theory, the potential for valuation disputes is reduced.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Lorewalker

That was my failed attempt at the point. It was done for their consignors. The house does not benefit at all from having done this.

I did raise the question the other day that Ryan and the house had already estimated the values of his consignments. Not sure if all 54 cards stolen were his but there was an agreement as to what they both felt the cards would sell for. I know that estimate prior to consignment being sent is not the same as the auctions having run their course but the house was not in total darkness about what those lots were worth. Turned out they were close to spot on. It begs the question if they really needed to leave the lots in there for valuation purposes.

Their valuations on specific lots were all over the map according to what Ryan posted, they just happened to work out in the aggregate. Not sure insurance is going to just accept a pre auction estimate either as you point out.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Their valuations on specific lots were all over the map according to what Ryan posted, they just happened to work out in the aggregate. Not sure insurance is going to just accept a pre auction estimate either as you point out.

I doubt they would take fake auction results either. If there is coverage.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Carter08

I doubt they would take fake auction results either. If there is coverage.

“They” meaning the insurance company?

Or “they” meaning the consignors?

I suspect the consignors might be okay with using that valuation method.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by raulus

“They” meaning the insurance company?

Or “they” meaning the consignors?

I suspect the consignors might be okay with using that valuation method.

The insurance company, if there is one or more providing coverage.