What was Ruth like as a pitcher?

[steve B]

We have a pretty good thread running about ruth and if he could hit todays pitching.

This video came across my facebook feed, and it's interesting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAlNdz30TX4

And it made me realize that we talk a ton about Ruth as a batter, but not as much about his pitching.

The two things that come to mind right off, is that he has aalmost a sidearm motion, instead of the straight overhand. And not just when pitching to kids, the small bit of game film out there shows the same thing.

The other one led to a bigger question.
He demonstrates a knuckleball. Was Ruth a Knuckleball pitcher, or at least mixing it in with other pitches. Or was it just done for the film.


I think this film is part of a series he did showing baseball playing tips. I have one that if I remember it right shows him teaching batting.

[Musashi]

I don't know about his pitch selection, but I know he faced Ty Cobb 76 times and struck him out 7 times. Compare that 9.2% Strikeout rate to Cobb's career rate of 5.9% against everybody else, and that tells you a little something about Babe's quality as a pitcher.

[packs]

No idea about his actually repertoire but just looking at his raw stats the knuckleball makes sense. He walked a ton of guys and wasn’t a power pitcher. He seems both hittable and hard to hit. Like players were putting the ball in play but not hitting it very well, which may also be explained by that knuckle.

[brunswickreeves]

I’m reading a great book on Joe Jackson. It mentions Babe Ruth’s MLB debut with the Red Sox was on July 11, 1914 at the age of 19. On that day he pitched a 4-3 win against…the Cleveland Naps. Ruth faced Joe Jackson as batter #3 and Nap Lajoie as batter #4. Joe hit 2 for 4, driving in 1 run.

Could you imagine that game?! Joe Jackson who hit .373 the year prior and what would be his last season with Cleveland before going to the fabled White Sox! And Ruth’s rookie year!!

[bnorth]

He would be by far the best ever. If you brought him to todays game he would dominate todays wimpy stars so much that he would make them look like they should still be playing t-ball.

[Snapolit1]

Watching this made me realize I have seen Ruth's face 10,000s of times and maybe heard his voice no more than 2 or 3 times.

[EddieP]

I mentioned this on another post, but Tris Speaker once said “ Babe Ruth made a great mistake when he gave up pitching.”

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Musashi

I don't know about his pitch selection, but I know he faced Ty Cobb 76 times and struck him out 7 times. Compare that 9.2% Strikeout rate to Cobb's career rate of 5.9% against everybody else, and that tells you a little something about Babe's quality as a pitcher.

I bet that sample size is statistically not very meaningful.

[Baseball Rarities]

brunswickreeves - That is a great photo, but it is actually from Ruth's rookie year in 1915. It pictures Foster, Mays, Shore, Ruth and Leonard from left to right. Here is another image that was taken at the same time from a different angle. (not mine)

[Beercan collector]

I’d bet he used all those pitches / Probably didn’t have a an incredible fastball - being such a good hitter he knew what hitters didn’t like at a certain time - I’m thinking Greg Maddux smarts But with more walks

[glchen]

Here is Babe Ruth's pitching advice from his 1935 Schutter Johnson card (not mine).

[mrreality68]

His 2015 season not a bad year

[brunswickreeves]

Originally Posted by Baseball Rarities

brunswickreeves - That is a great photo, but it is actually from Ruth's rookie year in 1915. It pictures Foster, Mays, Shore, Ruth and Leonard from left to right. Here is another image that was taken at the same time from a different angle. (not mine)

Thanks very much for clarifying the players and date. I love this pic!

[Lobo Aullando]

Won't take that bet. The p-value on a binomial distribution is 0.161.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I bet that sample size is statistically not very meaningful.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Lobo Aullando

Won't take that bet. The p-value on a binomial distribution is 0.161.

I don't know what you are talking about, or whether you are agreeing with me or disagreeing, but the next 76 at bats easily could have yielded a quite different strike out number for Cobb against Ruth. Not like some inevitable percentage is established by 7 strike outs in just 76 at bats, which easily could have been 5, or 9. I'll let Travis supply the technical explanation but I am trusting my gut here.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I don't know what you are talking about, but the next 76 at bats easily could have yielded a quite different strike out number for Cobb against Ruth. Not like some inevitable percentage is established by 7 strike outs in just 76 at bats, which easily could have been 5, or 9. I'll let Travis supply the technical explanation but I am trusting my gut here.

He's saying the same thing as you. The statistical distribution of striking out or not is a binomial event (meaning it's either true or false). The p-value gives you the likelihood of getting a 7 Strikeout sample from 76 at bats given his "true" Strikeout rate of 5.6% or whatever it was stated above.

I didn't run the test myself, just going off my gut/experience, but 0.16 passes the smell test.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I bet that sample size is statistically not very meaningful.

You beat me to it

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Musashi

I don't know about his pitch selection, but I know he faced Ty Cobb 76 times and struck him out 7 times. Compare that 9.2% Strikeout rate to Cobb's career rate of 5.9% against everybody else, and that tells you a little something about Babe's quality as a pitcher.

This would not be a statistically significant difference in a sample size of just 76 at bats though, just FYI