Heritage Auctions - Boston Garters

[MVSNYC]

FWIW, this is how it's been successfully executed in the past by auction houses like Mastros, Mile High, REA, Memorylane, etc. There's clear communication at the top of each lot (note the sentence at the very top of each lot page), and the lots are all linked and work together in unison. So bidders have real-time (official) visibility as to which is wining, and then can pivot and change bidding strategy if need be. (Images courtesy of a gentleman from New Jersey).

[JeremyW]

The consignor didn't know what they had, right? If Powell had been able to place another bid, it would have been another $5K for the consignor, right?

[Powell]

I’m moving on. It was a bad scene. I’m not suing anybody. I hope Aaron enjoys his card. It wasn’t his fault. I never thought I should get special treatment because I spend a lot of money. I should have had a fair chance to compete. The set lot was doomed and there is the unfairness. Anyway, I hope this experience reduces the risk it ever happens again. I appreciate the support from many of you. There are passionate collectors and many great people on this board whom I’ve learned a lot from. Thank you!

Powell

[JeremyW]

Originally Posted by Powell

I’m moving on. It was a bad scene. I’m not suing anybody. I hope Aaron enjoys his card. It wasn’t his fault. I never thought I should get special treatment because I spend a lot of money. I should have had a fair chance to compete. The set lot was doomed and there is the unfairness. Anyway, I hope this experience reduces the risk it ever happens again. I appreciate the support from many of you. There are passionate collectors and many great people on this board whom I’ve learned a lot from. Thank you!

Powell

Well handled.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Powell

I’m moving on. It was a bad scene. I’m not suing anybody. I hope Aaron enjoys his card. It wasn’t his fault. I never thought I should get special treatment because I spend a lot of money. I should have had a fair chance to compete. The set lot was doomed and there is the unfairness. Anyway, I hope this experience reduces the risk it ever happens again. I appreciate the support from many of you. There are passionate collectors and many great people on this board whom I’ve learned a lot from. Thank you!

Powell

I am sorry it worked out this way for you. As a lawyer i am glad you shared it because it certainly made for a fascinating discussion.

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I am sorry it worked out this way for you. As a lawyer i am glad you shared it because it certainly made for a fascinating discussion.

Hi Pete! Just another wringing observation (hi Jeff) how could damaged be claimed in such an event? Someone staying up all night and being heart broken? I just don't see the case here. It sucks and Heritage wouldn't even respond to consignor my signed 1952 topps set, but I can even begin to see what damages are here

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

Hi Pete! Just another wringing observation (hi Jeff) how could damaged be claimed in such an event? Someone staying up all night and being heart broken? I just don't see the case here. It sucks and Heritage wouldn't even respond to consignor my signed 1952 topps set, but I can even begin to see what damages are here

Ted as I posted a couple of times I don't see any claim for damages. In theory, if Heritage still had the cards, there could have been a claim for specific performance but one would have needed injunctive relief to keep the cards in place.

[tbob]

Originally Posted by Powell

I’m moving on. It was a bad scene. I’m not suing anybody. I hope Aaron enjoys his card. It wasn’t his fault. I never thought I should get special treatment because I spend a lot of money. I should have had a fair chance to compete. The set lot was doomed and there is the unfairness. Anyway, I hope this experience reduces the risk it ever happens again. I appreciate the support from many of you. There are passionate collectors and many great people on this board whom I’ve learned a lot from. Thank you!

Powell

You have certainly shown an admirable attitude toward this difficult situation. As a set collector who regretably anticipates that day arriving when I’ll have to make decisions on how my pre-war vintage collection is ultimately sold, it has certainly been a learning experience for me, and I suspect, others in the hobby.

B@b Marq@ette

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by Powell

I’m moving on. It was a bad scene. I’m not suing anybody. I hope Aaron enjoys his card. It wasn’t his fault. I never thought I should get special treatment because I spend a lot of money. I should have had a fair chance to compete. The set lot was doomed and there is the unfairness. Anyway, I hope this experience reduces the risk it ever happens again. I appreciate the support from many of you. There are passionate collectors and many great people on this board whom I’ve learned a lot from. Thank you!

Powell

I think Powell is a class act, the way he, in a mature fashion, handled this tragedy for himself. I hope in the future he is able to find some BGers for his collection.

[Vintagedeputy]

Maybe I’m missing something simple here and it could be because I generally don’t buy a lot in auctions like this.

If there was one auction for the entire lot and 12 individual auctions for the cards there has to be an ending time, right? If there is an extension of the ending time due to bids coming in in a certain timeframe then there is some point where bids stop coming in and the extended time stops right?

So when the extended time for the set and the extended time for each of the 12 lots finally stops, which ever amount is higher, the set bid or the individual lot bids, that’s who should get the winnings.

If their system sent Powell a message telling him that he won, one would naturally assume that the time had elapsed on the set bid extended time, and the individual lot extended time and their system then determined him to be the winner. If they told him he won then he won and should get the entire set.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Lots in HA do not end at a specific time but rather after a certain period (30 min I think here) of inactivity on that lot.

[Vintagedeputy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Lots in HA do not end at a specific time but rather after a certain period (30 min I think here) of inactivity on that lot.

My point is the same. There is some point in time that the bidding time has ended. At that point the system has to look at the bids and determine the winner. If their system sent Powell an email or a message or some kind of electronic signal that he won the set then his set bid must have been more than the calculated bids of all 12 cards individually. The set is his.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Vintagedeputy

My point is the same. There is some point in time that the bidding time has ended. At that point the system has to look at the bids and determine the winner. If their system sent Powell an email or a message or some kind of electronic signal that he won the set then his set bid must have been more than the calculated bids of all 12 cards individually. The set is his.

Joking/not joking:

Are you deliberately trying to restart this discussion at the beginning?

Because I think about 50 people (including Powell himself) made this exact argument about 6 pages ago. And we’ve spent the last 300 posts picking that argument up and examining it from most every side.

But maybe you skipped over that discussion?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Vintagedeputy

My point is the same. There is some point in time that the bidding time has ended. At that point the system has to look at the bids and determine the winner. If their system sent Powell an email or a message or some kind of electronic signal that he won the set then his set bid must have been more than the calculated bids of all 12 cards individually. The set is his.

For individual lots that ended earlier or at the same time, those guys almost certainly got a message THEY had won the lot. That's just the software doing its thing. It wasn't doing any comparing, because the software did not link all the lots together. Powell did not win the set, because some of the individual lots were still open and the sum ended hgher. The unfairness is Powell was unable to continue bidding. But that doesn't make him the winner.

Anyhow, it's all moot now.

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by MVSNYC

FWIW, this is how it's been successfully executed in the past by auction houses like Mastros, Mile High, REA, Memorylane, etc. There's clear communication at the top of each lot (note the sentence at the very top of each lot page), and the lots are all linked and work together in unison. So bidders have real-time (official) visibility as to which is wining, and then can pivot and change bidding strategy if need be. (Images courtesy of a gentleman from New Jersey).

I thought I recall those and the technology/software is there so why did HA which is a big auction house with deep pockets not have this in place.

Hopefully they put this in place prior to the next time they sell set vs Individual auction