Roberto Clemente Signature "Bob"

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

IF Clemente hadn't objected to Bob, why did Topps change his cards back to Roberto in 1970?

Somewhat of a fair point, but if it was indeed his objection that stopped the practice, it took him about 13 years to say something, so he couldn't have cared all that much.

[cgjackson222]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

Somewhat of a fair point, but if it was indeed his objection that stopped the practice, it took him about 13 years to say something, so he couldn't have cared all that much.

Just because it took Topps 13 years to change it back to Roberto doesn't mean it took Roberto 13 years to object.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by cgjackson222

Just because it took Topps 13 years to change it back to Roberto doesn't mean it took Roberto 13 years to object.

Exactly.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Not a primary source, but from the Hall of Fame.

Another practice of the media also upset Clemente. It did not involve his teammates, but rather had to do with his heritage and ethnicity. A number of writers and broadcasters insisted on calling Clemente “Bob” or “Bobby,” instead of his given name of Roberto. Even Clemente’s baseball cards listed him as “Bob Clemente,” a practice that persisted through the 1969 Topps set. Clemente did not like this practice, an effort at Americanizing him. He felt that it was disrespectful to his Puerto Rican and Latino heritage. When members of the media interviewed him and called him Bob or Bobby directly, he would correct them. “My name is Roberto Clemente,” he said repeatedly. In spite of his complaints, the practice of referring to Clemente as Bob, especially in print, would continue throughout the 1960s.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by cgjackson222

Just because it took Topps 13 years to change it back to Roberto doesn't mean it took Roberto 13 years to object.

OK, maybe, but maybe not. Let's say he objected early on and "Topps were being assholes" for years after the fact. If it truly mattered so much to him, why didn't he just pull a Maury Wills and tell Topps to take a hike when it came to using his image, etc.? Surely, Roberto didn't need their insulting chicken scratch or a new dishwasher or whatever. He could buy whatever he wanted without Topps' paltry payout.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

OK, maybe, but maybe not. Let's say he objected early on and "Topps were being assholes" for years after the fact. If it truly mattered so much to him, why didn't he just pull a Maury Wills and tell Topps to take a hike when it came to using his image, etc.? Surely, Roberto didn't need their insulting chicken scratch or a new dishwasher or whatever. He could buy whatever he wanted without Topps' paltry payout.

Suppose he wanted his cards available to the young Latin fans for whom he was a hero and pioneer>

[G1911]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

OK, maybe, but maybe not. Let's say he objected early on and "Topps were being assholes" for years after the fact. If it truly mattered so much to him, why didn't he just pull a Maury Wills and tell Topps to take a hike when it came to using his image, etc.? Surely, Roberto didn't need their insulting chicken scratch or a new dishwasher or whatever. He could buy whatever he wanted without Topps' paltry payout.

Originally Posted by JollyElm

There's no argument either way here with me, just pointing out some facts. We'd have to ask each player if labeling him 'Bob' on his card was what he wanted. Is there any first-hand info from Mr. Clemente himself?

We are supposed to make the assumptions required to arrive at the conclusion that was determined desirable before the inquiry, and dismiss the primary evidence and testimony of his friends that there was not a real issue here.

[cgjackson222]

Random tidbit: Roberto Clemente Walker chose the number 21 because his 3 names added up to 21 letters:

""He was hitting nothing but line drives and making lots of outs," recalls infielder Geene Freese, whose Forbes Field locker was next to Clemente's. "Meanwhile, I'm hitting blooper all over the place and batting .340. I told him, "You have a terrible number there. He said "What do you mean?" I said, "13 that's unlucky".

Clemente resolved to find a new number. He wrote out his full name-R-o-b-e-r-t-o-C-l-e-m-e-n-t-e-W-a-l-k-e-r (in Hispanic cultures, the mother's maiden name follows the father's surname)--added up the letters and decided 21 was a good fit.

The number was available because first baseman Tony Bartirome, who opened the season wearing 21 had been sent down."

Source: Indiana Gazette article by Bob Fulton, June 17, 2005

[Casey2296]

Bob/Roberto debate notwithstanding, I'm no autograph expert but a cursory search of his known signatures makes the 55 look suspect as hell.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

We had a "Bob" Clemente autographed piece from 1957 a few auctions ago. It seems it was not long thereafter that he changed to Roberto. I've never seen a later piece autographed as Bob.

https://thecollectorconnection.com/b...e?itemid=41345