Felix Mendelsohn & M101-4 and M101-5

[cubman1941]

BobC - checked the website out and, boy, is it great. I have bookmarked it. Thanks a lot for steering me to it.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by cubman1941

BobC - checked the website out and, boy, is it great. I have bookmarked it. Thanks a lot for steering me to it.

No problem Jim, always happy to help out a fellow collector, and discuss stuff like this. PM me if you have any other thoughts/questions. And would love to see what you come up with when you're done creating your files/spreadsheet.

For as much as we know about a lot of these pre-war and other vintage sets, there is an awful lot we still don't know or talk about. That is part of the fun of collecting, along with trying to remember everything you're learned or heard over the years. LOL

Over 25 years ago at a live auction I came across a near set of M101-4 blank back cards, about 95%+ of the set, but almost all of them were trimmed. And no, no big names like Cobb, Ruth, or Wagner. Paid about $1K for the near set, and afterwards kept asking myself, What was I thinking? LOL I foolishly ended up trading away all the trimmed cards (about 4 or 5 weren't trimmed) to a dealer at one of the Nationals back in the 90's in return for some cards he had that I wanted. Don't even remember what the cards were that I traded for now, but have since wished I had kept the trimmed near set. Oh well, live and learn, and never done anything like that since.

[spec]

Cubman,
While you are giving Mendelsohn his due, please rename the BF2 Ferguson set since they, too, are a Mendelsohn product that never had anything to do with the Boston bakery, which used an entirely different array of photos for the felts related to its D381 issue.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by spec

Cubman,
While you are giving Mendelsohn his due, please rename the BF2 Ferguson set since they, too, are a Mendelsohn product that never had anything to do with the Boston bakery, which used an entirely different array of photos for the felts related to its D381 issue.

If they never had anything to do with the Roxbury, Mass. area bakery, then how were they otherwise distributed by Felix Mendelsohn?

[spec]

Originally Posted by BobC

If they never had anything to do with the Roxbury, Mass. area bakery, then how were they otherwise distributed by Felix Mendelsohn?

Mail order through ads in publications.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by spec

Mail order through ads in publications.

So any idea where the thinking they were given away as premiums with the purchase of $0.05 loaves of bread came from then? Or was that possibly in addition to the sale through ads and publications? Also, I thought the BF2 large premium pennants were available after submitting something like 50 bread coupons for one. The reference to bread coupons would seem to indicate that a bakery may very well have been involved in their distribution after all.

I have never heard or seen anywhere that these BF2 pennants, though using the same black and white images from the M101-5 set produced by Felix Mendelsohn, were not then distributed by the Ferguson Bakery company out or Roxbury, Mass. I know the Old Cardboard and Pre-War Cards sites both name and show them as being issued by the Ferguson Bakery company, as do the Krause/SCD catalogs. Are the any sites or other sources that show and provide evidence that these BF2 pennants never had anything to do with the Ferguson Balery company? Would love to see/hear of any you can provide/link to. Thanks.

[nolemmings]

I have not seen any advertising that would show these came from Mendelsohn directly, or from any advertiser for that matter. There is a blotter with Ferguson bakery advertising that has served as the basis used by many to conclude the pennants came from there, and an old thread or two discussed the topic. I don’t believe the pennants shown on the blotter–and also a pillow topper that uses them- prove anything with regard to BF2, because they use the D381-style photos. In fact, I would argue that Ferguson Bakery would not have issued their 100 or so D381 cards in 1916 and then a completely different set of 100 or so BF2 pennants in the same year.

One minor correction, Bob– these use images from m101-4, not m101-5, and from an early printing at that, given the inclusion of the Stanage portrait to waist photo. FWIW, the source photo for the Cobb pennant has always mystified me.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

I have not seen any advertising that would show these came from Mendelsohn directly, or from any advertiser for that matter. There is a blotter with Ferguson bakery advertising that has served as the basis used by many to conclude the pennants came from there, and an old thread or two discussed the topic. I don’t believe the pennants shown on the blotter–and also a pillow topper that uses them- prove anything with regard to BF2, because they use the D381-style photos. In fact, I would argue that Ferguson Bakery would not have issued their 100 or so D381 cards in 1916 and then a completely different set of 100 or so BF2 pennants in the same year.

One minor correction, Bob– these use images from m101-4, not m101-5, and from an early printing at that, given the inclusion of the Stanage portrait to waist photo. FWIW, the source photo for the Cobb pennant has always mystified me.

Todd,

Thanks for the correction. I remember the M101-5 cards were actually issued before the M101-4 cards, and seem to always end up thinking of them first. LOL These sets have always intrigued me somewhat because they can be so confusing and misunderstood by many. I am by no means an expert on them or the various other distributors using the same images. Have always loved he BF2 pennants though, especially because they are so different and unique as a baseball collectible. And never really thought much before about how many of the BF2 pennants use the same Felix Mendelsohn images from their M101-4 cards.

And even if the images came from Felix Mendelsohn, it isn't necessarily the case that the Felix Mendelsohn company actually produced the BF2 pennants, is it? Could it be that whoever did create the pennants simply acquired the pictures/images from Felix Mendelsohn, and then attached them themselves to the pennants?

[BobC]

Originally Posted by spec

Cubman,
While you are giving Mendelsohn his due, please rename the BF2 Ferguson set since they, too, are a Mendelsohn product that never had anything to do with the Boston bakery, which used an entirely different array of photos for the felts related to its D381 issue.

If they never had anything to do with the Roxbury, Mass. area bakery, then how were they otherwise distributed by Felix Mendelsohn?