1947-66 Exhibits Jackie Robinson

[SSinneDD]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

There is one thread on this board somewhere (couldn't find it) where there was an extended debate over this issue. Some of the better ESCO minds (or just the more obsessed ones) are here, so it is interesting reading. In a nutshell, the earliest remotely likely issue date is for the 1948 season because the company just did not do rookie cards, it did established player cards. Even the rookie cards in ESCO are cards of guys with some time in the majors. The most valuable, the 1925 Gehrig, was issued in Lou's 3rd season in the Bronx. He was promising but had only appeared in two dozen games before Pipp's headache. Add in the racial factor and there is just very little chance of a 1947 ESCO Robinson card. I'd say none, unless someone finds an uncut sheet or checklist card. 1948 printing is a real possibility. As for how long they ran, ESCO pretty much dumped guys when they left MLB, so Robinson's run was most likely 1948-1956.

I know it is a tangent, but Doby and Paige are a lot easier because both were in the 1949 print run, which can be seen from the "An Exhibit Card" imprint on them. Paige was dumped very quickly, so his card is shorter printed than Robinson and has only the 1949 version (my reporting otherwise was, I am sorry to say, wrong).

Appreciate the info. If you come across that older thread, please post here for me.

[Snowman]

Exhibits have some great photos, and they're fun to collect, but they're not baseball cards. Nothing wrong with collecting small posters, but I get the fingernails on a chalkboard feeling whenever someone refers to them as baseball cards.

[bcbgcbrcb]

At this point, I think it’s safe to say that exhibits have gained acceptance in the mainstream as being baseball cards, a little larger than most but the values would not be where they are today if people didn’t consider them legitimate baseball cards.

[Vintagedeputy]

Originally Posted by bcbgcbrcb

At this point, I think it’s safe to say that exhibits have gained acceptance in the mainstream as being baseball cards, a little larger than most but the values would not be where they are today if people didn’t consider them legitimate baseball cards.

I don't consider exhibits to be baseball cards. I also don't consider Die Hard to be a Christmas movie, so what do I know?

[Rascal1010]

I would concur that the Robinson was more than likely printed in 1948. The example that I have in my collection was purchased from a machine in 1949 by my father. So, I can safely say that mine was at minimum printed no later than 1949 just because I know exactly when he purchased it. I do not consider this to be a RC per say, as those should be limited to the 1946 Parade Sportive, 1947 Bond Bread issue's & the 1947 Team issued card. It is however a very early in his career MLB uniform issued card.

[steve B]

Why wouldn't they be baseball cards?


Other than the ones with postcard backs, they are....
Cards
That have baseball players on them
Issued in sets each year, even if there's a lot of similarity from one year to the next for many of them. Sort of like T206, and the Old Judges...

The size shouldn't be the problem, they're smaller than Turkey Reds.
And there are several other about postcard sized sets out there that are considered sets that are on thinner cardstock and also weren't issued in packs.

The not issued in packs shouldn't be a problem either, as most strip cards weren't and are considered to be baseball cards. (and pretty much all Topps sets from at least 57 until whenever they stopped doing vending boxes were sold both in packs and through vending machines)

[Exhibitman]

Actually, in the 1960s, as the arcades closed, ESCO tried to sell its cards in packs.



I thought this might be interesting to add to the discussion to show how flexible the company's printing was:



As you can see, this sheet has Salutations of Pafko, Feller and Elliott (allegedly printed only through 1946), a 1949 Rizzuto (with the An Exhibit Card marking at the lower left), a Robinson, and some basic mid-1950s cards. The Newcombe card, for example is likely from the 1950 or later print run. Newcombe made his big-league debut on May 20, 1949. Unlikely that an early season call-up would be in the 1949 set, and there is no "An Exhibit Card" marking on Newk's card, which would be on a new 1949 card. The Ashburn also is not the AEC marked version. Ashburn's first game was April 20, 1948. He does have an AEC version from 1949, which I think can rightly be called a rookie card:



They also misspelled his name "Ritchie". There is also a clear 1950 card based on the size of the MADE IN USA marking:



Still with his name messed up. This is the one that shows on the uncut sheet. Here is Richie Ashburn with the misspelling corrected:



I think the sheet is likely a 1950, so the Robinson would have 3 years printing at that point.

The rookie stuff may be difficult to solve, but the ESCO card is a career-contemporary card with a nice image.

Dennis, if you want to see some Robinson eye candy, there is a thread on the postwar board that is all Jackie, all the time, and the collectors here have posted some rare and really interesting cards there.

[SSinneDD]

Originally Posted by Vintagedeputy

I don't consider exhibits to be baseball cards. I also don't consider Die Hard to be a Christmas movie, so what do I know?

Made my morning with that comment.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Vintagedeputy

I don't consider exhibits to be baseball cards. I also don't consider Die Hard to be a Christmas movie, so what do I know?

"Now I have a machine gun. Ho Ho Ho!"

I mean, even if you take out all of the Christmas songs throughout the movie, this seems like it should be enough to count.

[Exhibitman]

It is definitely a Christmas movie, L.A. version. We don't dream of a white Christmas, just one without a drive-by.

[Vintagedeputy]

Originally Posted by SSinneDD

Made my morning with that comment.

Glad to have provided you with some joy!

Originally Posted by raulus

"Now I have a machine gun. Ho Ho Ho!"

I mean, even if you take out all of the Christmas songs throughout the movie, this seems like it should be enough to count.

I feel that a Christmas movie should have Christmas as the focus. In A Christmas Story, Ralphie’s focus is on getting that BB gun for Christmas. That’s a Christmas movie.

If John McClane was going out to LA to visit Holly for New Years Eve or Easter, the movie would still be about terrorists. There’s a big difference between a movie with Christmas as the focus and a movie that happens to take place at Christmas time.

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Exhibits have some great photos, and they're fun to collect, but they're not baseball cards. Nothing wrong with collecting small posters, but I get the fingernails on a chalkboard feeling whenever someone refers to them as baseball cards.

Common sentiment, no doubt, but I never got it. They are technicaly cards (post cards, or cards the size of post cards), albeit bigger. To me they have always looked and felt like cards. They came from a machine and not a pack. I have a much harder time rationalizing Goudey Premiums or team photo sets for example as cards, but Exhibits always seemed to me to be just another type of card.

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Exhibits have some great photos, and they're fun to collect, but they're not baseball cards. Nothing wrong with collecting small posters, but I get the fingernails on a chalkboard feeling whenever someone refers to them as baseball cards.

I'm not sure if you are aware of how thick they are, but they're definitely not posters.

[whiteymet]

Originally Posted by SSinneDD

Appreciate the info. If you come across that older thread, please post here for me.

Dennis:

Here is the thread Adam was referencing. You have to scroll down a bit to find where VintageHoarder tries to convince everyone that ALL the Mays Exhibits he purchased were indeed his true Rookie card. No amount of proof could convince him otherwise

[sealmark41]

Hello All:
Interesting thread for sure. Years ago I put together a list of what I consider to be my complete set of BB exhibits 1947 forward. The current thread includes no mention of cards that had neither "made" or "printed" So what do we make of that?

And please do not suggest reprints as the couple I have noticed have the cream colored backs and have been in my posession since the 1960's.

Thanks a lot,

Sealmark
mkbow2@surewest.net

[whiteymet]

Originally Posted by sealmark41

Hello All:
Interesting thread for sure. Years ago I put together a list of what I consider to be my complete set of BB exhibits 1947 forward. The current thread includes no mention of cards that had neither "made" or "printed" So what do we make of that?

And please do not suggest reprints as the couple I have noticed have the cream colored backs and have been in my posession since the 1960's.

Thanks a lot,

Sealmark
mkbow2@surewest.net

Please list/show the cards you reference with "neither made or printed"

I know of one off the top of my head. Walker Cooper. Interested to see others you have since you say you have a "couple"

[tschock]

Originally Posted by sealmark41

Hello All:
Interesting thread for sure. Years ago I put together a list of what I consider to be my complete set of BB exhibits 1947 forward. The current thread includes no mention of cards that had neither "made" or "printed" So what do we make of that?

And please do not suggest reprints as the couple I have noticed have the cream colored backs and have been in my posession since the 1960's.

Thanks a lot,

Sealmark
mkbow2@surewest.net

Not counting 'burnt bottom' types (see Adam's 5 for 10 cent pack shown previously), here are the list of 1947-1966 Exhibits with no Made or Printed statements.

Max Alvis
Bob Aspromonte
Steve Barber
Earl Battey
Johnny Callison
Dean Chance
Tom Cheney
Choo Choo Coleman
Walker Cooper
Roger Craig
Joe Cunningham (Portrait)
Don Drysdale (Glove at waist)
Dick Farrell
Tony Gonzalez
Ray Herbert
Chuck Hinton
Frank Howard
Ken Hubbs
Joey Jay
Harvey Kuenn (“SF” on cap)
Phil Linz
Don Lock
Bill Mazeroski (Batting)
Ken McBride
Charley Neal
Bill O’Dell
Camilo Pascual
Jimmy Piersall
John “Boog” Powell
Brooks Robinson
Frankie Robinson
Bob Rogers (Rodgers)
Richard Rollins
Pete Runnels
Ron Santo
Lee Thomas
Leon Wagner
Billy Williams
Maurice Wills
Carl Yastrazemski (Yastrzemski)

[sealmark41]

Dennis:

Your list of no "made" or "printed" exhibit cards is identical to my master collection list put together many years ago. Curious if you have the 40 you list or if by some chance you came across my list. I too am in Nor Cal so perhaps we could chat.
Mark K. Bowers
mkbow2@surewest.net

[SSinneDD]

Originally Posted by sealmark41

Dennis:



Your list of no "made" or "printed" exhibit cards is identical to my master collection list put together many years ago. Curious if you have the 40 you list or if by some chance you came across my list. I too am in Nor Cal so perhaps we could chat.

Mark K. Bowers

mkbow2@surewest.net

Hey Mark, I'm fairly new to exhibits... The list from my post way above, was found via Google and another thread from net54.


Sent from my LM-X220 using Tapatalk

[SSinneDD]

Originally Posted by whiteymet

Dennis:



Here is the thread Adam was referencing. You have to scroll down a bit to find where VintageHoarder tries to convince everyone that ALL the Mays Exhibits he purchased were indeed his true Rookie card. No amount of proof could convince him otherwise

Thanks. Can't wait to read it.
Edit- can you post link when you have a moment, I do not see it. Thanks

EDIT- Found it, https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=298095

Sent from my LM-X220 using Tapatalk

[rjackson44]

The jackies i have were bought at the gloria shows along with a ted williams.think $25 a piece might be wrong .But no more

[sealmark41]

Whitey: Don't have time to go thru my entire exhibit collection but 4 I found with little searching include:
Ted Williams sincerely
Ken Hubbs portrait
Boog Powell portrait
Carl Yaz portrait

There must be others I would guess. Any input appreciated
mkbow2@surewest.net

[whiteymet]

Originally Posted by sealmark41

Whitey: Don't have time to go thru my entire exhibit collection but 4 I found with little searching include:
Ted Williams sincerely
Ken Hubbs portrait
Boog Powell portrait
Carl Yaz portrait

There must be others I would guess. Any input appreciated
mkbow2@surewest.net

Hi Mark:

I believe the Ted Williams Sincerely does have a MADE IN USA at the bottom.

See: https://www.ebay.com/itm/16555352827...32d2fd62f8bfab

As for the others you note, and later lists by Taylor here in this thread, you are correct.

I am an oldhead and only think of the earlier pre 60 Exhibits which is why I mentioned the Walker Cooper as the only card I was aware of without a notation. All the others referenced are from the last/1966 set ESCO produced

[sealmark41]

Whitey:
On second look you are correct. Not only does the "9" showing have "made" but on further magnification the non "9" showing also has "printed" but really hard to see.

Thanks a lot for this clarification

Mark

[andypcl]

Sorry for the sideways pic. I'm posting for my dad (sealmark) and I believe he meant "Sincerely Yours" on the Ted exhibit. I took this pic during a recent visit and even with a magnifying glass I couldn't make out any text. BUT, In this enlarged picture, it definitely has "Printed in US" on the bottom right . Very hard to see with the light print and background.

[whiteymet]

It really depends on which issue (Year) of the Ted Williams ( no 9) you look at.

His card was basically issued every year till the early 60's. So he comes with both Printed in USA and Made in USA notations.

Here is another one where you can clearly see the notation

https://www.ebay.com/itm/15533155333...Bk9SR-r0o8vGYQ