Hey, pennant guys

[Domer05]

Originally Posted by ooo-ribay

Question for Kyle:

With all the subtle variations we’ve been seeing, how often do you think the pennant makers would have had to “change out” their screens? I think Trench made thousands of the left handed batter and bridge for the Giants. I wonder how many they could get out of one screen…

Good question. Once you burn your screen (stencil), if made properly, it could last several thousand runs. They're quite durable.

If the pennant was polychromatic, it might actually be made with up to four screens, depending on how many colors it featured. (One screen per color.)

I suspect for each pennant they burned a couple of screens, just in case the primary screen became damaged, e.g., torn mesh. If they were trying to screen a lot of pennants really quickly, like an NL/AL champs pennant for sale at a world series, you might have multiple presses printing the same pennant, side by side.

Here's what a well used screen looked like after a few thousand runs at Chicago Pennant Co....

[bocca001]

If they needed a new screen because the old wore out, would they copy it somehow? In a way that might “lessen” the quality of the original graphics? Or would they start from new?

[Domer05]

Originally Posted by bocca001

If they needed a new screen because the old wore out, would they copy it somehow? In a way that might “lessen” the quality of the original graphics? Or would they start from new?

I think if that company owned the original artwork, and they needed to burn another screen, they would remake it using the original artwork--which was likely saved in a file somewhere for just such a purpose. Therefore, I'd expect the successive screens to match the quality of the first.

But, if you were gonna burn a screen by ripping off someone else's artwork, which certainly happened in the pennant biz, then perhaps your knock-off stencil would lose some detail during the translation process? Additionally, if the the resulting pennant were made on a screen with a different mesh count than those made from the original, that would certainly result in a slightly different looking pennant.

Sometimes you might change your screen to a lower mesh count to improve the opacity of your print. Other times you might go with a screen with a higher mesh count to enhance the detail of your print. There are sooooo many variables when making a pennant.

It's all trial and error.... I'm certain some makers made adjustments midway through a production run resulting in very minor variations.

Gives us something to talk about, that's for sure!

[thetahat]

Welcome Phil and Phillis to the pennant basement! These are technically pennants as they have a spine on the back for a dowel …

Anyone from the South Jersey area ever seen the original Phil and Phillis Veterans Stadium “statues” at Storybook Land?

[Domer05]

Greg, I always thought those were cool products! Glad that they made it to the basement.

I believe those were made by HANCO, right? Did they make these for any other MLB teams? I wanna say I've seen one for the Minnesota Twins, maybe?

[ooo-ribay]

I may have nightmares about Phil and Phillis!

[thetahat]

Originally Posted by Domer05

Greg, I always thought those were cool products! Glad that they made it to the basement.

I believe those were made by HANCO, right? Did they make these for any other MLB teams? I wanna say I've seen one for the Minnesota Twins, maybe?

Correct. HANCO. And yes I’ve seen the Twins but no other.

Here they are, permanently residing in Egg Harbor Township, NJ. A must see for anyone making the drive from Philly to Atlantic City.

[perezfan]

Gotta believe these were made by same company with the dowel column running down the center. The Reds had 2 versions of this…. Mid 1970s manufacture, just like Phil and if Phillis.

https://www.ebay.com.sg/itm/39419385...UAAOSwUE5hcIcx

[Fballguy]

Originally Posted by Domer05

Greg, I always thought those were cool products! Glad that they made it to the basement.

I believe those were made by HANCO, right? Did they make these for any other MLB teams? I wanna say I've seen one for the Minnesota Twins, maybe?

They made the Orioles as well.

[Fballguy]

And Batman.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by Domer05

Good question. Once you burn your screen (stencil), if made properly, it could last several thousand runs. They're quite durable.

If the pennant was polychromatic, it might actually be made with up to four screens, depending on how many colors it featured. (One screen per color.)

I suspect for each pennant they burned a couple of screens, just in case the primary screen became damaged, e.g., torn mesh. If they were trying to screen a lot of pennants really quickly, like an NL/AL champs pennant for sale at a world series, you might have multiple presses printing the same pennant, side by side.

Here's what a well used screen looked like after a few thousand runs at Chicago Pennant Co....

Good info, as always.

We did some silk screening in HS (I think) shop class. I seem to remember using an X-acto knife to cut the stencil. What do you mean by “burning” a screen?

The Seattle screen is cool….do you own it?

[ooo-ribay]

I think this is only the second purple Giants pennant I own.

[Domer05]

Originally Posted by ooo-ribay

Good info, as always.

We did some silk screening in HS (I think) shop class. I seem to remember using an X-acto knife to cut the stencil. What do you mean by “burning” a screen?

The Seattle screen is cool….do you own it?

The screens were "burned" because the process involved exposing the screen to a UV light source before performing a "wash out" resulting in the stencil you saw above.

That green substance you see, called "emulsion," is photo sensitive. It's dry/hardened now; but, when it was first developed, the artwork/graphics would have been transferred to transparent paper; then placed atop the dried emulsion inside a dark room. After exposing it to a UV light source for a few minutes, the exposed parts of the emulsion would harden and become waterproof. The unexposed areas (covered by the artwork/graphics) would remain, however, water soluble. When hit with a blast of water, this area of the screen would blow out, creating holes for paint to pass through.

That's how these stencils were made....

[ooo-ribay]

^^^^ pretty much how you do yours, yes?

Am I dreaming in thinking I somehow used an X-acto knife in shop class?

[Domer05]

Exact same process. With a lot less fancy equipment.

...and no X-acto knives.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by Domer05

Exact same process. With a lot less fancy equipment.

...and no X-acto knives.

My last word on this…..I could have sworn we cut some sort of film with an X-acto knife…maybe to make a “negative” to bond to a screen? I dunno…it was a looooong time ago.

I just checked screen printing kits on Amazon….none of them include X-acto knives.