Does Collectors Have Potential Conflicts?

[53toppscollector]

I think the fact that the first card PSA ever graded was graded incorrectly and was done to try and help establish them in the business is a huge red flag.

I went through a phase where I thought graded cards are the solution to a lot of problems, but I've moved past that. I'd only ever grade in the future if I planned to sell the cards for a profit to facilitate purchases for my actual collection.

As for Nat Turner, the guy is a legit card collector and he loves it. Telling him that he can no longer get cards graded would be tough, but there is an obvious conflict of interest there if he is submitting raw cards to get graded by the company he owns, especially since a guy with his wealth is probably not submitting a bunch of junk wax era commons for grading.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by 53toppscollector

I think the fact that the first card PSA ever graded was graded incorrectly and was done to try and help establish them in the business is a huge red flag.

I went through a phase where I thought graded cards are the solution to a lot of problems, but I've moved past that. I'd only ever grade in the future if I planned to sell the cards for a profit to facilitate purchases for my actual collection.

As for Nat Turner, the guy is a legit card collector and he loves it. Telling him that he can no longer get cards graded would be tough, but there is an obvious conflict of interest there if he is submitting raw cards to get graded by the company he owns, especially since a guy with his wealth is probably not submitting a bunch of junk wax era commons for grading.

Turner shouldn't have to stop getting cards graded, just not graded by a TPG that he at the same time works for/with, has ownership in, or any other connections or relationships. Any company/person in the business of giving a professional opinion on anything, should be independent and without bias or conflict of interest in the rendering of such an opinion in both fact AND appearance.

Nat should ONLY be sending any cards he looks to be getting graded now to any TPG other than the one he owns. Of course, how would we ever find out if he was having PSA still grading cards for him? There is virtually (and pretty much literally) no transparency, independent oversight, or outside policing of the entire TPG business/industry that I'm aware of. I am not saying or accusing any TPG of intentionally doing anything illegal or wrong, but if a TPG's sole purpose is to give unbiased opinions as to the authenticity and condition of cards they examine and grade, you would think that the TPGs themselves would be going out of their way to promote and showcase their independence and fairness in consistently giving honest and totally unbiased opinions to the public, and thus their potential customers. At least if that's what a TPG is really all about.

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by 53toppscollector

I think the fact that the first card PSA ever graded was graded incorrectly and was done to try and help establish them in the business is a huge red flag.

I went through a phase where I thought graded cards are the solution to a lot of problems, but I've moved past that. I'd only ever grade in the future if I planned to sell the cards for a profit to facilitate purchases for my actual collection.

As for Nat Turner, the guy is a legit card collector and he loves it. Telling him that he can no longer get cards graded would be tough, but there is an obvious conflict of interest there if he is submitting raw cards to get graded by the company he owns, especially since a guy with his wealth is probably not submitting a bunch of junk wax era commons for grading.

Again to my point, David Hall, who started this company submitted truck loads of T206s and who knows what else while he was with the company. Nothing new here if Turner submits, collects, etc. Was mentioned in one of his interviews that he is so impassioned with the hobby that he moved his office into the grading area.

[53toppscollector]

Oh I agree, it was an obvious conflict for David Hall too

[drcy]

There should be an at least informal advisory independent hobby oversight group about grading, authentication, auction ethics, etc. Maybe it could be done through SABR.

However, as everyone knows, the hobby is full of conflicts of interest, etc.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by drcy

There should be an at least informal advisory independent hobby oversight group about grading, authentication, auction ethics, etc. Maybe it could be done through SABR.

However, as everyone knows, the hobby is full of conflicts of interest, etc.

SABR is about history and research, not necessarily collecting cards. It is also strictly baseball oriented, whereas TPGs grade cards from all sports, and beyond, such as Pokemon, Magic the Gathering, etc. As I noted earlier, with so many different factions and groups into collecting and grading, it will be virtually impossible to find a group/venue with which to unite them all. The perfect time to have set up such a group may have passed back in Burdick's time. He would have been the perfect person to establish and head up a true collector's organization/club that could set standards, and have current TPGs possibly toeing the line or face ostracizing and loss of business from members who would not use their services if the collecting club/organization did not approve.

Unfortunately, too many people/businesses have too much time, effort, and especially money, tied up into graded cards of existing TPGs to probably ever allow such a new group to threaten the current status quo. It may take a catastrophic scandal, or other unbelievable and unforeseen development, to rock the card collecting hobby enough to where such significant changes would ever have a snowball's chance in hell of succeeding and improving the TPG industry from where it currently sits, unfettered, uncontrolled, and answering to no one but itself.

[drcy]

I picked SABR because it is a well-known and respected organization that knows how to make committees.

Originally Posted by BobC

SABR is about history and research, not necessarily collecting cards. It is also strictly baseball oriented, whereas TPGs grade cards from all sports, and beyond, such as Pokemon, Magic the Gathering, etc. As I noted earlier, with so many different factions and groups into collecting and grading, it will be virtually impossible to find a group/venue with which to unite them all. The perfect time to have set up such a group may have passed back in Burdick's time. He would have been the perfect person to establish and head up a true collector's organization/club that could set standards, and have current TPGs possibly toeing the line or face ostracizing and loss of business from members who would not use their services if the collecting club/organization did not approve.

Unfortunately, too many people/businesses have too much time, effort, and especially money, tied up into graded cards of existing TPGs to probably ever allow such a new group to threaten the current status quo. It may take a catastrophic scandal, or other unbelievable and unforeseen development, to rock the card collecting hobby enough to where such significant changes would ever have a snowball's chance in hell of succeeding and improving the TPG industry from where it currently sits, unfettered, uncontrolled, and answering to no one but itself.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by drcy

I picked SABR because it is a well-known and respected organization that knows how to make committees.

David,

Agree with you 100%, but the trick is getting Pokemon and other such collectors to buy in. Because of all the different collecting factions, we might have better luck with a new organization encompassing ALL the different types of collectors out there. And have that new organization then approach groups like SABR for their support and endorsement. Using SABR will likely make a lot of people think it is primarily a baseball card-centric issue/focus, which is certainly not what you would want.