Crypto in Ahs?

[prestigecollectibles]

I accept Zelle and so does REA and Lelands. You can't do a chargeback.

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

The reason PP, CC and Zelle aren't accepted isn't technology based it's Chargeback based.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by prestigecollectibles

I accept Zelle and so does REA and Lelands. You can't do a chargeback.

Robert,

So what is your outfit going to do when you get the 1099-K from Zelle? Do they break down the reported total Zelle sales and end up sending out 1099s reporting respective sales to each consignor (and the IRS) for the consignor's actual share of auction proceeds they receive? Or does your outfit not get that much in the way of Zelle payments (yet) so the 1099 sales amount reported to your company by Zelle ends up being less than the actual amount of commissions/fees they actually earned for the year, so the just report their actual commission/fees income and as long as it ends up being greater than what's on Zelle's 1099-K to them for that same year, they don't do or report anything else to any consignors or the IRS?

[prestigecollectibles]

I don't get that many sales with Zelle, but according to their website they don't issue a 1099 or report anything. It is like sending a wire transfer, but with some limitations and no fees.

https://www.zellepay.com/faq/does-ze...than%20%24600.

Does Zelle® report how much money I receive to the IRS?

Zelle® does not report transactions made on the Zelle Network® to the IRS. The law requiring certain payment networks to provide forms 1099K for information reporting does not apply to the Zelle Network®.

Originally Posted by BobC

Robert,

So what is your outfit going to do when you get the 1099-K from Zelle? Do they break down the reported total Zelle sales and end up sending out 1099s reporting respective sales to each consignor (and the IRS) for the consignor's actual share of auction proceeds they receive? Or does your outfit not get that much in the way of Zelle payments (yet) so the 1099 sales amount reported to your company by Zelle ends up being less than the actual amount of commissions/fees they actually earned for the year, so the just report their actual commission/fees income and as long as it ends up being greater than what's on Zelle's 1099-K to them for that same year, they don't do or report anything else to any consignors or the IRS?

[oldjudge]

If an auction house takes bitcoin and such I assume they convert it as soon as they can. They are in the business of providing a platform for sales, not in speculating in cryptocurrency.

[CJinPA]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

If an auction house takes bitcoin and such I assume they convert it as soon as they can. They are in the business of providing a platform for sales, not in speculating in cryptocurrency.

True - most likely converting pretty soon after accumulation. That said, I'd be really surprised if AH's took anything other than BTC or ETH.

And not to get off topic too much, but crypto as a technology is NOT speculative. Some elements certainly are but Bitcoin, Ethereum and some are NOT! Think 1998 - 2002 and the entire dotcom bubble..... boy did Amazon boom and bust.... Bitcoin is better, the entire crypto ecosystem is more important that the internet of the 90's.... we are in early times.

I'll be selling some of my vintage collection and unopened wax here in the coming weeks - these are historic times!

[Jobu]

Given how quickly the price of crypto fluctuates, I am surprised that an AH would risk it.

AH: Sends invoice on Friday.
Customer: Pays on Sunday using crypto.
Monday: AH shows up to work, the coin is down 11% from the day before.

So the AH just takes the loss? It seems like it would be a challenge to always be able to immediately convert a crypto payment, but I am not experienced in the ways of crypto and maybe the AHs that take it have a 24-hour alert set up so they never miss it the second one of those payments comes in.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by Jobu

Given how quickly the price of crypto fluctuates, I am surprised that an AH would risk it.

AH: Sends invoice on Friday.
Customer: Pays on Sunday using crypto.
Monday: AH shows up to work, the coin is down 11% from the day before.

So the AH just takes the loss? It seems like it would be a challenge to always be able to immediately convert a crypto payment, but I am not experienced in the ways of crypto and maybe the AHs that take it have a 24-hour alert set up so they never miss it the second one of those payments comes in.

And I would assume/hope that loss doesn't get passed through to the seller/consignors. Unless they actually asked to be paid in crypto.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by CJinPA

True - most likely converting pretty soon after accumulation. That said, I'd be really surprised if AH's took anything other than BTC or ETH.

And not to get off topic too much, but crypto as a technology is NOT speculative. Some elements certainly are but Bitcoin, Ethereum and some are NOT! Think 1998 - 2002 and the entire dotcom bubble..... boy did Amazon boom and bust.... Bitcoin is better, the entire crypto ecosystem is more important that the internet of the 90's.... we are in early times.

I'll be selling some of my vintage collection and unopened wax here in the coming weeks - these are historic times!

Until various governments get tired of the largely unregulated status and start creating their own government sponsored/backed digital currency(ies). In which cases they may ban independent digital currencies, or do something to much more closely regulate/control them.

Interesting, after some further checking it turns out Zelle sneaked through a loophole, and is not subject to the IRS' 1099-K reporting requirements. Earlier stories and reports I had read always seemed to lump Zelle in with Paypal, Venmo, and similar third-party services, and that all of them would be subject to the same reporting requirements. Good to know.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by prestigecollectibles

I don't get that many sales with Zelle, but according to their website they don't issue a 1099 or report anything. It is like sending a wire transfer, but with some limitations and no fees.

https://www.zellepay.com/faq/does-ze...than%20%24600.

Does Zelle® report how much money I receive to the IRS?

Zelle® does not report transactions made on the Zelle Network® to the IRS. The law requiring certain payment networks to provide forms 1099K for information reporting does not apply to the Zelle Network®.

Now that is interesting to hear and know. I have never personally worked with or used Zelle, but was under the impression it operated similarly to Paypal, Venmo, and other similar third-party Payment Settlement Entities (PSEs). And that therefore it is also subject to these 1099-K reporting requirements. But that is only for reporting payments for goods and services using such third-party payment network services. Is this specific Zelle Network(R) only for personal and not any type of business use then, and thus exempt from any 1099-K reporting requirements? I'll have to look into that.

And apparently Zelle did catch some loophole so its payments are exempt from 1099-K reporting. Goood news to know.

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by BobC

Now that is interesting to hear and know. I have never personally worked with or used Zelle, but was under the impression it operated similarly to Paypal, Venmo, and other similar third-party Payment Settlement Entities (PSEs). And that therefore it is also subject to these 1099-K reporting requirements. But that is only for reporting payments for goods and services using such third-party payment network services. Is this specific Zelle Network(R) only for personal and not any type of business use then, and thus exempt from any 1099-K reporting requirements? I'll have to look into that.

And apparently Zelle did catch some loophole so its payments are exempt from 1099-K reporting. Goood news to know.

This is why Zelle has become the new method of late other than PPFF for many sellers. A quick sweep of secondary marketplaces is now full of Zelle mentions since the states and then feds started launching these new methods for redistribution of funds to seemingly anyone but me, lol.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by JustinD

This is why Zelle has become the new method of late other than PPFF for many sellers. A quick sweep of secondary marketplaces is now full of Zelle mentions since the states and then feds started launching these new methods for redistribution of funds to seemingly anyone but me, lol.

Absolutely right, and makes perfect sense. And I wasn't aware of this till just reading this thread either. We can all learn and come across new information daily, as long as we keep an open and ever-inquiring mind.

Can easily see Zelle making a huge jump over other services like Paypal because of this new, lowered 1099-K reporting threshold, and apparent lack of fees (at least currently) for using Zelle. However, just to completely be up front, it also appears Zelle offers no protection for buyers using this payment service, like you'd otherwise have if using a credit card or Paypal - Goods and Services. Zelle is basically the same as Paypal - Friends and Family, no fees and no 1099-K reporting requirements, but also no similar sales/account protections.

[sb1]

I believe the difference may be that Zelle is essentially an electronic check/transfer between banks and not a payment processor.