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#1
08-30-2021, 02:43 AM
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Quote:
It's been a little while since we've updated or questioned the current Old Mill checklist. Here is a list of my current differences from my checklist and why. I'd post scans, but have been having some issues where I can't see my pictures but some others can. The problem came out of nowhere. I changed nothing on my end. PRINT GROUP ONE - 150/350 SERIES Joe Birmingham (Should Be Added) (PSA shows 4) (SGC shows 2) Fred Clarke - Batting (Should Be Added) (PSA shows 3) (SGC shows 2) Bob Ganley (Should not be on this list, being an elite 11) Cy Seymour - Batting (Should Be Added) (PSA shows 0) (SGC shows 1) Patrick Romolo posted a scan recently, also. PRINT GROUP TWO - 350 ONLY SERIES Josh Clark (Should be removed) (Both Pop Reports Show Zero) Unless a scan can be confirmed. T206Resource shows as confirmed, but I question it. Chief Myers - Fielding (Should Be Added) (PSA shows 13) (SGC shows 8)
__________________
Ron - Uncle Nacki T206 Master Monster Front/Back Set Collector - www.youtube.com/unclenacki T206 Basic "The Monster" Set 514/524 T206 Advanced "Master Monster" Front/Back Set ??  ??/5258COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS Old Mill Southern Leagues - Black Ink 48/48 Sweet Caporal 350-460 Factory 30 Full Color "No Prints" 28/28 NEAR COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS Polar Bear 245/250 Sovereign 460 50/52 Sweet Caporal 150 Factory 649 Overprint 31/34 Piedmont 350 "Elite 11" 9/11 Last edited by Ronnie73; 08-30-2021 at 02:48 AM. 
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#2
08-30-2021, 08:32 AM
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T206 Reference......
Quote:
I have Imageevent host all my scans. I have never had any problems posting my scans. OK, it has been 3 years since I last updated that OLD MILL checklist in this main T206 REFERENCE thread. If you check-out my T206 Checklist Thread.... T206 REFERENCE....convenient access to T206 checklists I think you will find it's OLD MILL checklist is up-to-date. Here is the OLD MILL excerpt from it......  To date....311 subjects (Major Leaguers) have been confirmed. They are listed here with respect to their T206 series. 150/350 Series..................125 subjects Abbaticchio (brown sleeves) Alperman Ames (portrait) Ball (New York) Bates Beaumont Bell (hands over head) Bender (portrait) Bergen (bat) Birmingham Bowerman Bradley (portrait) Bransfield Bridwell (portrait-no cap) Bresnahan (portrait) M. Brown (portrait) Camnitz (arms folded) Chance (red portrait) Chase (pink portrait) Chase (white cap) Chesbro Cicotte Clarke (portrait) Clarke (with bat) JJ Clarke Cobb (green) Cobb (bat on shoulder) Conroy (fielding) Coveleski Crandall (no cap) Crawford (throwing) Criss George Davis (Chicago) Harry Davis (A's) Delehanty (Washington) Donlin (seated) Donovan (portrait) Doolin Dougherty (portrait) Durham Evers (portrait) Ferris Flick Gibson Gilbert Goode Griffith (portrait) Hahn Hemphill Herzog (New York) Hinchman (Cleveland) Isbell Jacklitsch Jennings (portrait) Johnson (portrait) F. Jones (portrait) F. Jones (hands at hips) Jordan (portrait) Joss (portrait) Keeler (portrait) Keeler (bat) Killian (pitching) Kleinow (bat) Kling Konetchy (glove high) Lajoie (portrait) Lajoie (throwing) Lake (New York) Leach (portrait) Leifield (pitching) Liebhardt Lobert Lumley Magee (portrait) Manning (bat) Marquard (hands at side) Mathewson (portrait) Mathewson (white cap) McGraw (portrait-no cap) McGraw (pointing) McIntyre (Brooklyn) McQuillan (ball in hand) Merkle (portrait) Murphy (throwing) Nicholls (hands on knees) Niles Oldring (fielding) O'Leary (portrait) Overall (portrait) Owen Parent Pastorius Powell Ritchey Rucker (portrait) Schlei (catching) Schmidt (throwing) Seymour (batting) Sheckard (no glove) Shipke F. Smith (Chicago) Spade Stahl (no glove) Steinfeldt (portrait) Stone Stovall (portrait) Sullivan L Tannehill (Chicago) Tenney Tinker (portrait) Tinker (hands on knees) Turner Waddell (portrait) Waddell (throwing) Wagner (bat on left) Wallace Walsh Weimer Doc White (portrait) Wilhelm (hands at chest) Williams Willis (portrait) Wiltse (portrait-no cap) CYoung (portrait) CYoung (bare hand) 350-only Series..................76 subjects Abbott Anderson Atz Batch Beck Bender (trees) Blackburne Bliss Brain Brown (Washington) Burke Burns Bush Campbell Casey Collins (A's) Congalton Cravath Cree Dahlen (Brooklyn) Dineen Joe Doyle (hands over head) Dubuc Dunn (Baltimore) Dunn (Brooklyn) Easterly Egan Elberfeld (portrait-Washington) Fiene (portrait) Fiene (throwing) Flanagan Freeman Fromme Gasper Graham (Boston) Hallman Hannifan Hartsel Hinchman (Toledo) Hoblitzell Hofman Hoffman (Providence) Hulswitt Jackson Kelley Kisinger Kleinow (New York-catching) Knight (bat) Krause (portrait) Kruger Lavender Livingstone McCormick Milligan Myers (fielding) Oakes Oberlin Parent Pfeister (seated) Purtell Quillen Rhoades (arm extended) Scott Smith (Buffalo) F. Smith (white cap) Stanage Stephens Sweeney (Boston) J. Tannehill (Washington) Taylor Thomas Titus White (Buffalo) Wilson Wright Zimmerman 350/460 series..................58 subjects Ames (hands over head) Baker Bender (no trees) Berger Bradley (bat) M. Brown (Chicago) Burch (fielding) Cobb (bat off shoulder) Conroy (bat) Crawford (bat) Harry Davis (A's) Donlin (bat) Doolan (bat) Dougherty (arm in air) Downey (bat) Larry Doyle (bat) Elberfeld (Washington-fielding) Griffith (bat) Jennings (one hand) Jennings (two hands) Johnson (pitching) Jordan (bat) Joss (pitching) Kleinow (Boston) Konetchy (glove low) Lajoie (bat) Lake, St. Louis (no ball) Leach (cap) Leifeld (bat) Magee (bat) Manning (pitching) McIntyre (Brooklyn & Chicago) McQuillan (bat) Mullin (bat) Murphy (bat) Nichols (bat) O'Leary (hands on knees) Overall (yellow sky) Pelty (vertical) Pfeister (throwing) Reulbach (no glove) Rucker (throwing) Seymour (throwing) F. Smith (Chicago & Boston) Snodgrass (catching) Stahl (glove) Steinfeldt (bat) Street (catching) Sweeney (fielding) Tinker (bat off shoulder) Wagner (bat on right) Doc White (Chicago-pitching) Wilhelm (bat) Willetts Willis (throwing) Willis (bat) Wiltse (pitching) CYoung (glove) 460-only Series..................46 subjects Abbaticchio (blue sleeves) Ball (Cleveland) Bell (follow thru) Bergen (catching) Bescher (hands over head) Bridwell (portrait-cap) Camnitz (hands over head) Camnitz (arm at side) Chance (bat) Chase (trophy) Crandall (portrait-cap) Devore Duffy Larry Doyle (portrait) Ford Frill Gandil Geyer Herzog (Boston) Howell (hand at waist) Hummel Lake, St. Louis (ball) Latham Marquard (pitching) McGraw (portrait-cap) McGraw (glove at hip) Merkle (throwing) Meyers (portrait) Murray (portrait) Needham Oldring (batting) Overall (blue sky) Payne Pfeffer Schaefer (Washington) Schlei (portrait) Schlei (bat) Schulte (back view) Seymour (portrait) Sheckard (glove) Smith (Brooklyn) Stovall (bat) Tannehill (Chicago) Tinker (bat on shoulder) Wheat Wiltse (portrait-cap) Six Super-Prints Chance (yellow portrait) Chase (blue portrait) Chase (dark cap) Cobb (red portrait) Evers (Chicago-yellow sky) Mathewson (dark cap) TED Z .
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#3
08-30-2021, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
It's got to be some setting somewhere. I have a dedicated Microsoft web server, along with Microsoft SQL with GoDaddy. I don't have any issues with other websites or direct links to pictures. But when I add that link in a post, it doesn't show up in the preview or the post for me to see it, but supposedly other users are able to see the pictures, because they comment on them. But they don't show up for me. So I can't even check for error's before posting. I even tried different browsers. It's an odd issue, probably my computer. I had a similar problem years ago when I was hosting my own web servers in my house. I couldn't see pictures or load a web page if I tried to view it directly on that web server, but if I loaded the same page on my desktop, I could see everything. It ended up being a setting on the web server IIS. Internet connections, along with Server and Microsoft software updates, got too expensive, so now I just pay $250 a month with GoDaddy, and can run unlimited websites and databases, along with unlimited emails.
__________________
Ron - Uncle Nacki T206 Master Monster Front/Back Set Collector - www.youtube.com/unclenacki T206 Basic "The Monster" Set 514/524 T206 Advanced "Master Monster" Front/Back Set ?? ??/5258COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS Old Mill Southern Leagues - Black Ink 48/48 Sweet Caporal 350-460 Factory 30 Full Color "No Prints" 28/28 NEAR COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS Polar Bear 245/250 Sovereign 460 50/52 Sweet Caporal 150 Factory 649 Overprint 31/34 Piedmont 350 "Elite 11" 9/11
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#4
09-01-2021, 07:20 PM
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T206 REFERENCE, Theories, Surveys, etc.
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Ron I was wondering if you had a chance to try Imageevent for displaying your scans ? About a year ago, my computer had a complicated problem which prevented me from posting my scans from them. I called their help desk in California. I was on the phone with them for 40 minutes, and their guy guided me thru several procedures till we finally solved the problem. I was quite impressed with their service. Incidentally, their annual fee is very reasonable. Good Luck, TED Z T206 Reference .
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#5
09-02-2021, 06:30 AM
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A question that has been going through my pea sized brain for years, and I am sure it has been answered...why did Jefferson Burdick name the t206 cards t206 and not t205, since they came first (1909 - 1911)? Why aren't t205s (1911) t206s instead? He or no one else cared to keep the sets chronological for some reason I am missing? Just asking.
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#6
09-04-2021, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Here's a Birmingham, it's in rough shape but it's an Old Mill. img803.jpg
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#7
09-21-2021, 12:30 PM
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T206 REFERENCE.....interesting similarities between T206 Doyle Nat'L and T207 Hoff
* * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * *
       ..... Piedmont ........ Sweet Caporal .......... EPDG_______The "House" that created these Tobacco cards______UZIT ................ Hindu ....... American Beauty I have always been fascinated by the Joe Doyle Nat'L card and the T207 Chester "Red" Hoff cards. I've never owned the Doyle Nat'L card; however, I have handled 2 of them over these past 14 years in the process of ascertaining their legitimacy. One of them was legitimate. The other one was a FAKE, as indicated by a very subtle minute flaw. Anyhow, both them started pitching for the NY Highlanders. Both only 5' 9" and both had only 5-year careers. Here's where they differ....Joe Doyle lived to age 66, Chet Hoff lived to the grand old age of 107. Regarding their BB cards...... The Joe Doyle Nat'L card is the scarcest T206 card with only 9 of them (or perhaps 10) that are known (as of this date). The Chet Hoff card is by no means a rare card; however, it is one of the tougher cards to find in the T207 set.  ------  Stay tuned for more on this subject. TED Z . Last edited by tedzan; 09-30-2021 at 07:02 PM. Reason: Corrected typo.
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#8
09-21-2021, 12:55 PM
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Your T207 Hoff is a great looking card, and the Hoff card is one of the nicer portraits in the set. The one I have is my only T207 Cycle, and it has the added bonus of Buck Barker scribbling on its back as well. All of this makes it one of my T207 favorites.
Brian
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#9
09-21-2021, 01:30 PM
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Is this the thread for general T206 discussion/questions? Because I wanted to talk about Hindu Browns.
As I put together my Excel master tracker for my portraits project, and as I did my research on the different backs, I obviously came to understand that Hindu Brown was the toughest back for the 150 series, and I'd have to track down a lot of tough HoF in the Hindu back. However, I don't think I appreciated just how scarce some of these backs actually are. Today I was taking a look through ebay just to see what was listed and what has been sold in the last 3 months in the Hindu Brown department, and let me tell you, its not a lot at all. 21 total sales in the last 3 months 12 cards currently listed for sale They are still more populous than Carolina Brights, Broad Leaf, Lenox, Drum, and Uzit, but not that much more. Of the 21 sales noted above, it was actually less than 21 unique subjects, because there were multiple Griffith and Clarkes sold. For the purposes of my master portrait project, I created 3 groups of backs: All Piedmonts + SweetCaps (except Piedmont 42), then AB, Cycle, EPDG, Old Mill, Polar Bear, Sovereign, Tolstoi and P42, and the third group of Hindu Brown/Red, Carolina Brights, Broad Leaf, Drum, Lenox and Uzit. I initially thought it might have been wrong to group the Brown Hindu in with that 3rd "ultra rare" group, but the more I think about it, the more I think that is appropriate at this point, given their availability. I put together a combined PSA + SGC Pop report for the portraits back in June/July, and the combined populations of Hindu Brown range from 9 (O'Leary) to 38 (WaJo) with an average of about 20. What is interesting is that if you compare the Hindu Brown totals to a back that is perceived to be less scarce like Tolstoi, it is quite interesting. There are currently 93 Tolstois listed on ebay (I didnt check each one, but it looks like this count is close), and there were 54 Tolstois sold in the last 3 months. When you dig into pop reports, I have 54 possible portraits in a Tolstoi back, with pops ranging from 1 (Rossman) to 44 (Chance Yellow and Crandall w/Cap), with an average population of 14. So on average, a Tolstoi back will be more rare than a Brown Hindu for the portrait subjects, but there are more Tolstois on the market than Brown Hindus. Using the old multipliers for pricing, if I remember right the Tolstoi was around 3x and the Brown Hindu was around 14x in Scot Reader's 2012 update. As of now, I believe the complete Tolstoi checklist is 255 cards, with another 59 that are possible/probable. The Hindu Brown checklist is 136 cards. There is no way to directly compare them, since no subject with a Brown Hindu back also appears with a Tolstoi back. Curious to hear thoughts on this
__________________
My T206 research thread My T205 Census thread Want list: M101-2, T205s (American Beauties) Last edited by 53toppscollector; 09-21-2021 at 01:31 PM.
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#10
09-21-2021, 06:31 PM
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T206 REFERENCE.....interesting similarities between T206 Doyle Nat'L and T207 Hoff
Quote:
Chet Hoff Hoff made his big league debut in September 1911, the Highlanders were playing at Hilltop Park in the Washington Heights section of Manhattan. In his second major league game, Hoff, a 20-year-old left-hander fresh off the Westchester County sandlots was summoned in relief against the Detroit Tigers. Chet recalled it 80 years later....."the batter fouled off two -- the first two strikes were fastballs. The 3rd strike I threw him was a fast curve. It was a perfect strike over the plate and he looked at it. But at that time I didn't know who he was, no more than the man in the moon, until the next morning I picked up The New York Journal. The big red headlines in the paper says Hoff Strikes Out Ty Cobb. I couldn't believe it at first. It was the biggest thrill of my Baseball career." I acquired this Hoff autograph back in the 1990's. The signature is well written, so he probably signed it many years ago. I got it from a known autograph collector in the hobby.    TED Z T206 REFERENCE....convenient access to T206 checklists . Last edited by tedzan; 09-22-2021 at 06:39 AM. Reason: Corrected typo.
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#11
09-23-2021, 06:31 AM
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Quote:
Hi James, I have 254 Tolstoi's confirmed the same list as t206resource I think it's actually 253 (I believe Bender with trees is a PSA flip error) which one do you have confirmed that's not confirmed on this list? Bender with trees is confirmed 8-22-22 https://www.t206resource.com/Tolstoi%20Checklist.html Last edited by Pat R; 08-22-2022 at 11:06 AM.
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#12
09-23-2021, 07:01 AM
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Reprising my TOLSTOI information......
* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
   When American Lithographic started printing the 350 Series T206's, they introduced new T-brands: AMERICAN BEAUTY, BROAD LEAF, CAROLINA BRIGHTS, CYCLE, DRUM, EPDG, OLD MILL, POLAR BEAR, and TOLSTOI . TOLSTOI print runs started circa early 1910. Continued to the end of the T206 press runs (Spring 1911). To date, 255 subjects have been confirmed. Most TOLSTOI cards are not tough to find. However, certain 350-only subjects printed early in 1910 must have been short-printed, as they are very tough to find.  TOLSTOI checklist (255 subjects) confirmed. They are listed here according to their respective T206 series. 350-only Series...................146 subjects Abstein Anderson Arellanes Atz Barbeau Barger Barry (A's) Bender (trees)............. ? Bescher (portrait) Blackburne Bliss Brain Brashear Bresnahan (bat) Burchell Burns Bush Byrne Campbell Carrigan Casey Chappelle Charles Clark Clymer Collins (Milwaukee) Collins (A's) Cree Cross Davidson Delehanty (Louisville) Demmitt (New York American) Dineen Doolan (fielding) Dorner Downey (fielding) Downs Joe Doyle (NY) Dubuc Jack Dunn Joe Dunn Dygert Easterly Engle Evans Ferguson Fiene (throwing) Fletcher Ganzel Gasper Graham (St Louis) Gray Grimshaw Groom Hartsell Hayden Hinchman (Toledo) Hoblitzell Hoffman (Providence) Hoffman (St Louis AL) Hofman Howard (Chicago NL) Howell (portrait) Huggins (portrait) Huggins (hands at mouth) Hunter Jones (Detroit) Kelley Killian (portrait) Kisinger Kleinow (New York-catching) Knight (portrait) Knight (bat) Krause (portrait) Krause (pitching) Kroh LaPorte Lattimore Lavender Lennox Livingstone Lord Maddox Maloney Marquard (portrait) Mattern McAleese McBride McCormick McElveen McGinnity McIntyre (Detroit) McLean Merritt Milan Miller (Pittsburg) Mitchell (Cincinnati) Mitchell (Toronto) Moeller Moran (Chicago NL) Mowrey Murray (bat) Myers (batting) Myers (fielding) Nattress Nichols (bat) Oakes O'Brien O'Neill Paskert Perring Pfeister (seated) Phillippe Purtell Puttman Quillen Quinn Randall Rhoades (arm extended) Rhoades (hands at chest) Rhodes Ritter Rossman Rudolph Schmidt (portrait) Schreck Scott Shannon Sharpe Slagle Smith (Chicago, white cap) Smith (Buffalo) Snodgrass (bat) Speaker Starr Stanage Stephens Strang Summers Taylor Thomas Unglaub Warhop Willett Wilson Zimmerman 350/460 series...................57 subjects Ames (hands over head) Baker Bender (no trees) Berger Bradley (bat) M. Brown (Chicago) Burch (fielding) Cobb (bat off shoulder) Conroy (bat) Crawford (bat) Harry Davis (A's) Donlin (bat) Doolan (bat) Dougherty (arm in air) Downey (bat) Larry Doyle (bat) Elberfeld (Washington-fielding) Griffith (bat) Jennings (one hand) Jennings (two hands) Johnson (pitching) Jordan (bat) Joss (pitching) Kleinow (Boston) Konetchy (glove low) Lajoie (bat) Lake, St. Louis (no ball) Leach (cap) Leifeld (bat) Magee (bat) Manning (pitching) McIntyre (Brooklyn & Chicago) McQuillan (bat) Mullin (bat) Murphy (bat) O'Leary (hands on knees) Overall (yellow sky) Pelty (vertical) Pfeister (throwing) Reulbach (no glove) Rucker (throwing) Seymour (throwing) F. Smith (Chicago & Boston) Snodgrass (catching) Stahl (glove) Steinfeldt (bat) Street (catching) Sweeney (fielding) Tinker (bat off shoulder) Wagner (bat on right) Doc White (Chicago-pitching) Wilhelm (bat) Willetts Willis (throwing) Willis (bat) Wiltse (pitching) CYoung (glove) 460-only Series...... ..........46 subjects Abbaticchio (blue sleeves) Ball (Cleveland) Bell (follow thru) Bergen (catching) Bescher (hands over head) Bridwell (portrait-cap) Camnitz (hands over head) Camnitz (arm at side) Chance (bat) Chase (trophy) Crandall (portrait-cap) Devore Duffy Larry Doyle (portrait) Ford Frill Gandil Geyer Herzog (Boston) Howell (hand at waist} Hummel Lake, St. Louis (ball) Latham Marquard (pitching) McGraw (portrait-cap) McGraw (glove at hip) Merkle (throwing) Meyers (portrait) Murray (portrait) Needham Oldring (batting) Overall (blue sky) Payne Pfeffer Schaefer (Washington) Schlei (portrait) Schlei (bat) Schulte (back view) Seymour (portrait) Sheckard (glove) H. Smith (Brooklyn) Stovall (bat) Tannehill (Chicago) Tinker (bat on shoulder) Wheat Wiltse (portrait-cap) Six Super-Prints Chance (yellow portrait) Chase (blue portrait) Chase (dark cap) Cobb (red portrait) Evers (Chicago-yellow sky) Mathewson (dark cap) This is a work is stillin progress. TED Z . Last edited by tedzan; 09-23-2021 at 07:32 AM. Reason: Corrected typo.
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#13
09-23-2021, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
__________________
My T206 research thread My T205 Census thread Want list: M101-2, T205s (American Beauties)
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#14
09-23-2021, 07:30 AM
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TOLSTOI cards
Quote:
Hi James (53toppscollector) However, I have never seen the Bender (trees) with a TOLSTOI back, So, I am inclined to agree with Pat R, that it is possibly a grading labelling error. I have annotated this entry on my list with a ? TED Z T206 REFERENCE....convenient access to T206 checklists .
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...besides Walter Johnson, Chase is my favorite player from the deadball era.
. 
Hybrid Mode
