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Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Postwar Baseball Cards Forum (Pre-1980)

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  #1  
Old 08-23-2021, 07:07 PM
king11 king11 is offline
B!ll K!ng
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Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Arizona, USA
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Default Congratulations!

This is really nice work - thanks so much for sharing!

(And, as additional confirmation of the Spahns, the most commonly found miscut of Spahn appears to be to the right of Pascual, but there are a couple out there where Spahn appears to be to the right of Allie. See attached photos.)
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  #2  
Old 08-23-2021, 08:49 PM
G1911 G1911 is offline
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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Thank you for posting this Copper, this is great stuff. I'm awfully surprised this is the layout, I thought it was a very simple 1-110 cards, the two half sheets matching, no SP's or DP's. Interesting they got janky with the numbers and held off a run of consecutive cards (1953 was at least random card #'s not being issued with a series).

Checking my stack of 1955's, I have Card 90 with a white back (a trademark of a series 1 card, the other series only have cream, which was on every card), and card 100 with a white back, but 91-99 are all cream only, no whites sure enough. I can cross these off my want list now.
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  #3  
Old 08-23-2021, 10:58 PM
coppercoins coppercoins is offline
Chuck Daughtrey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G1911 View Post
Thank you for posting this Copper, this is great stuff. I'm awfully surprised this is the layout, I thought it was a very simple 1-110 cards, the two half sheets matching, no SP's or DP's. Interesting they got janky with the numbers and held off a run of consecutive cards (1953 was at least random card #'s not being issued with a series).

Checking my stack of 1955's, I have Card 90 with a white back (a trademark of a series 1 card, the other series only have cream, which was on every card), and card 100 with a white back, but 91-99 are all cream only, no whites sure enough. I can cross these off my want list now.
An image of the back side one of the known sheet #1s is miscut across the top and shows the bottom of the stats on the upper sheet half, and they are exactly the same cards as the bottom row of the bottom sheet half. They were evidently actually printed 220 at a time. Given the sheet half at the top is also configuration #1, this tells me that there were two matching halves on each printed sheet of 220.
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  #4  
Old 08-24-2021, 02:29 AM
coppercoins coppercoins is offline
Chuck Daughtrey
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My dream begins to come to life!!!

I am going to digitally recreate the sheet I had to build from a very blurry old image. Of course what I build will be digital only and it won't be printable, so don't worry. I'm a graphic designer and know the laws.

Below is a partial of the upper-left corner of the image I am building of the mystery sheet that only has one known image to date.

Thank you guys!!

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  #5  
Old 08-25-2021, 09:04 AM
G1911 G1911 is offline
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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To get started on the presumed 2nd and 3rd series, I checked my set for miscuts and found none. But I did find a border defect shared by two cards in the same spot that probably were next to each other or next to some test strip on the edge of the sheet or similar. 192 Delsing and 168 Pillette
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  #6  
Old 08-25-2021, 09:27 AM
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toppcat toppcat is offline
Dave.Horn.ish
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G1911 View Post
Thank you for posting this Copper, this is great stuff. I'm awfully surprised this is the layout, I thought it was a very simple 1-110 cards, the two half sheets matching, no SP's or DP's. Interesting they got janky with the numbers and held off a run of consecutive cards (1953 was at least random card #'s not being issued with a series).

Checking my stack of 1955's, I have Card 90 with a white back (a trademark of a series 1 card, the other series only have cream, which was on every card), and card 100 with a white back, but 91-99 are all cream only, no whites sure enough. I can cross these off my want list now.
I think some of the discrete numbering holes (not holdbacks of ranges of #'s) in 53 and 55 were due to uncertainty over Bowman exclusives. Not sure why 54 doesn't have the any holes but it was a very fluid situation in the courts and with the lawyers for awhile. As for holdbacks of # ranges, that seems more intentional. Topps must have needed at least four series of issue for 1954 (like the year prior) and three for 1955 with the small number of cards in those sets, especially '55 so some cardboard sorcery makes sense.

1955 seems like a right mess for sure, it must have been chaotic putting that one together.

Last edited by toppcat; 08-25-2021 at 09:59 AM.
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  #7  
Old 08-25-2021, 11:31 AM
G1911 G1911 is offline
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toppcat View Post
I think some of the discrete numbering holes (not holdbacks of ranges of #'s) in 53 and 55 were due to uncertainty over Bowman exclusives. Not sure why 54 doesn't have the any holes but it was a very fluid situation in the courts and with the lawyers for awhile. As for holdbacks of # ranges, that seems more intentional. Topps must have needed at least four series of issue for 1954 (like the year prior) and three for 1955 with the small number of cards in those sets, especially '55 so some cardboard sorcery makes sense.

1955 seems like a right mess for sure, it must have been chaotic putting that one together.
This is how I always thought of it too; the hold backs were cards assigned to specific players that deals fell through on or jumped to Bowman. The discovery of some unused 1953 artwork being evidence this was the case, though I don't recall all the details.

I'm rethinking it now. 53 and 55 both appear to have hold backs in all (1953, EDIT: actually I think one of the series didn't...) or most (1955? Were there 2 or 3 series even?). Perhaps it was just the old trick of leaving a few numbers out to keep kids buying more gum. A missing range like this certainly lends credence to some intentional skip numbering to drive sales through dirty means. This certainly seems to be the case in 1955. I'll be looking for miscuts of 91-99 to see if any of them can be linked to other cards on the sheet.

A good reminder that right when I think I've solved a puzzle via deduction (series 1 is 1-110 because of the white backs, no SP's or DP's necessary on the 110 card sheet), it's not actually solved, just a guess that best fits the few parts of the puzzle available to me at a moment.

The traditional alignment of:
1-150
151-160
161-210 with 4 DP's in this range

is definitely wrong. Anyone have miscuts of 91-99 or 111-210 to share? I'll go hunting this week for scans outside my collection.


My 55 set is, sadly, missing Clemente as his price has taken off to a point I just find unreasonable for a high print run card. I'll probably break down at some point just to finish. Having fun piecing together a full set of white/cream backs and all the little recurring print defects too, 55-56 were just great designs I never get tired of. I got my first one almost 20 years ago, so it's been a slow, slow build among other projects. Any excuse to take it's box out of the safe and go through again is welcome

Last edited by G1911; 08-25-2021 at 11:31 AM.
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  #8  
Old 08-25-2021, 11:37 AM
G1911 G1911 is offline
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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And as to the 1954's.... I've never made heads or tails at all out if it's series, aside from what seems the obvious that 1-50 must be a series (gray back run). Topps used 100 card half-sheets then, I believe, so this would suggest the full set twice on each side. From 51-250, I've never figured out what's up, but haven't gone to the miscuts yet to slowly try and piece together. Never seen a sheet of them or anything to cut the work down.
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  #9  
Old 08-25-2021, 11:26 PM
coppercoins coppercoins is offline
Chuck Daughtrey
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Default Finally there!

Ladies and Gentlemen...this phase of the project is complete. I now introduce you to the only (known) digital reproduction of the "lost" 1955 Topps Baseball Sheet #2 configuration as sold at auction in 1993 and not seen since. Original image I worked from, and the final graphic which any of you may use for whatever you like.



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  #10  
Old 08-26-2021, 12:44 AM
G1911 G1911 is offline
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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Would make a nice desktop background!
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