Did anybody else snipe tonight's pwcc?

[toledo_mudhen]

Yea - a bit concerning and I'm sure I paid up on it - highly possible/probable shill - but it is cool!

[bobbyw8469]

Cool that you showed that Robinson. I won one of the error variations on Hunt last night. They made no mention of the error, but I saw it, and I assume someone else saw it as well, because the bidding was spirited.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

Yea - a bit concerning and I'm sure I paid up on it - highly possible/probable shill - but it is cool!

With this mentality...the shilling/shadiness will certainly continue!

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

With this mentality...the shilling/shadiness will certainly continue!

Guilty as charged - I think someone once said "Stuff Trumps Everything"

[dstudeba]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

Guilty as charged - I think someone once said "Stuff Trumps Everything"

Is the 1955 Topps Robinson a tough card?

[Snapolit1]

I too am very interested in the dynamics of auctions. Should have studied economics. Really interesting stuff.

It seems like the driving force behind some many of these larger purchases is "gee lot of other people think this a totally hot shit card so it much be." If something is dead it must be dead for a reason; and if it's on fire getting lots of bids it must be a great great thing. Sort of the same mentality at the horse races. I had a friend who was heavy duty horse player and he never even bothered to learn the basics of reading the racing form. His strategy was always watching the board, and monitoring what others were doing. This always struck me as crazy (and not a lot of fun), but it is the same kind of decision making that drives a lot of crowd based decisions these days. If Amazon Prime says this is a great deal it must be kind of stuff. Of course the same mentality holds for stocks. People chase winners and often times chase it way too late, and the real gains may already be cooked in.

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by dstudeba

Is the 1955 Topps Robinson a tough card?

The card itself is not tough - A solid mid grade with Near Perfect Centering, Full Diamond, and absolutely killer Color and Registration - is

[dstudeba]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

The card itself is not tough - A solid mid grade with Near Perfect Centering, Full Diamond, and absolutely killer Color and Registration - is

So the kind of opportunity you get once every 5 or so years, that makes sense.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

The card itself is not tough - A solid mid grade with Near Perfect Centering, Full Diamond, and absolutely killer Color and Registration - is

I thought partial diamond was the tough one?

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

I thought partial diamond was the tough one?

hmmm....and I was thinking that the "partial diamond" was basically a function of the centering...the further away from 50/50 the more the top and left diamond points get cut off?

So on your "partial diamond" would the amount of points cutoff directly coincide with the centering values?

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

I thought partial diamond was the tough one?

Bobby - I stand corrected

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1955-TOPPS-...4AAOSw7xlfXZz0

Or maybe not?

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

Yea - a bit concerning and I'm sure I paid up on it - highly possible/probable shill - but it is cool!

Not a PSA 5, LOL. It's SGC 5.5 and you got worked for $300 by the PWCC shillers:mad :

I would have sold you this for the same price.

[Snapolit1]

There are plenty of cards on PWCC that don't get a great price. Believe me, I learned first hand. The idea that all of the auctions are shilled is silly.

[NYYFan63]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

There are plenty of cards on PWCC that don't get a great price. Believe me, I learned first hand. The idea that all of the auctions are shilled is silly.

Agreed


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

There are plenty of cards on PWCC that don't get a great price. Believe me, I learned first hand. The idea that all of the auctions are shilled is silly.

There will be plenty of drunk drivers on the road this Saturday who don't barrel into a family coming home from Grandma's house. Believe me, I learned first hand. The idea that all drunk drivers kill families is silly.

The logic of the 2nd statement mirrors the logic of the first. See the problem with the logic to both statements? Just because not every PWCC auction is shilled does not excuse or minimize the fact that a significant subset of PWCC auctions are shilled. If that doesn't bother you, bid away.

[Snapolit1]

Don't see where there an fallacy buried in my argument, but you're entitled to your opinion.

Maybe PWCC is engaged in criminality. I have no idea. Perhaps some US Attorney somewhere will shed some light on that in the near future and one of our board members will rise to their defense. I have no idea. But I assume with any auction on eBay, whether I am am bidding on cards, photos, spray bottles of Lysol, or exercise equipment, that there is a very real possibility that the buyer may run the price up through his own actions (multiple eBay aliases) or with some good friends. That's why when I went on eBay last week looking for a pair of 45 pound dumb bells I did some research and decided in advance how much I wanted them and how high I would pay. And once they exceed that number I waved them goodbye.






QUOTE=Exhibitman;2030264]There will be plenty of drunk drivers on the road this Saturday who don't barrel into a family coming home from Grandma's house. Believe me, I learned first hand. The idea that all drunk drivers kill families is silly.

The logic of the 2nd statement mirrors the logic of the first. See the problem with the logic to both statements? Just because not every PWCC auction is shilled does not excuse or minimize the fact that a significant subset of PWCC auctions are shilled. If that doesn't bother you, bid away.[/QUOTE]

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by snapolit1

don't see where there an fallacy buried in my argument, but you're entitled to your opinion.

Maybe pwcc is engaged in criminality. I have no idea. Perhaps some us attorney somewhere will shed some light on that in the near future and one of our board members will rise to their defense. I have no idea. But i assume with any auction on ebay, whether i am am bidding on cards, photos, spray bottles of lysol, or exercise equipment, that there is a very real possibility that the buyer may run the price up through his own actions (multiple ebay aliases) or with some good friends. That's why when i went on ebay last week looking for a pair of 45 pound dumb bells i did some research and decided in advance how much i wanted them and how high i would pay. And once they exceed that number i waved them goodbye.



Shipping on 45 lb dumbells would be more than the cost of the dumbells!!!





Quote=exhibitman;2030264]there will be plenty of drunk drivers on the road this saturday who don't barrel into a family coming home from grandma's house. Believe me, i learned first hand. The idea that all drunk drivers kill families is silly.

The logic of the 2nd statement mirrors the logic of the first. See the problem with the logic to both statements? Just because not every pwcc auction is shilled does not excuse or minimize the fact that a significant subset of pwcc auctions are shilled. If that doesn't bother you, bid away.

[/quote]

[ullmandds]

[QUOTE=Snapolit1;2030271]Don't see where there an fallacy buried in my argument, but you're entitled to your opinion.

Maybe PWCC is engaged in criminality. I have no idea. Perhaps some US Attorney somewhere will shed some light on that in the near future and one of our board members will rise to their defense. I have no idea. But I assume with any auction on eBay, whether I am am bidding on cards, photos, spray bottles of Lysol, or exercise equipment, that there is a very real possibility that the buyer may run the price up through his own actions (multiple eBay aliases) or with some good friends. That's why when I went on eBay last week looking for a pair of 45 pound dumb bells I did some research and decided in advance how much I wanted them and how high I would pay. And once they exceed that number I waved them goodbye.

shipping on 45 lb dumbells would be more than the cost of the dumbells!!!

[Snapolit1]

Funny you should say that. . . . .I've ordered a bunch of dumbbells since the pandemic rolled in and in every case the seller simply threw each weight in a priority mail card box box with zero packing. The 35s and 45s came across the country in cardboard boxes, of course mangled, falling apart, bashed in, torn, etc. . . . . looking like they were just thrown out an airplane. Insanity. But I guess it works.






[QUOTE=ullmandds;2030287]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Don't see where there an fallacy buried in my argument, but you're entitled to your opinion.

Maybe PWCC is engaged in criminality. I have no idea. Perhaps some US Attorney somewhere will shed some light on that in the near future and one of our board members will rise to their defense. I have no idea. But I assume with any auction on eBay, whether I am am bidding on cards, photos, spray bottles of Lysol, or exercise equipment, that there is a very real possibility that the buyer may run the price up through his own actions (multiple eBay aliases) or with some good friends. That's why when I went on eBay last week looking for a pair of 45 pound dumb bells I did some research and decided in advance how much I wanted them and how high I would pay. And once they exceed that number I waved them goodbye.

shipping on 45 lb dumbells would be more than the cost of the dumbells!!!

[obcmac]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Don't see where there an fallacy buried in my argument, but you're entitled to your opinion.

Maybe PWCC is engaged in criminality. I have no idea. Perhaps some US Attorney somewhere will shed some light on that in the near future and one of our board members will rise to their defense. I have no idea. But I assume with any auction on eBay, whether I am am bidding on cards, photos, spray bottles of Lysol, or exercise equipment, that there is a very real possibility that the buyer may run the price up through his own actions (multiple eBay aliases) or with some good friends. That's why when I went on eBay last week looking for a pair of 45 pound dumb bells I did some research and decided in advance how much I wanted them and how high I would pay. And once they exceed that number I waved them goodbye.

QUOTE=Exhibitman;2030264]There will be plenty of drunk drivers on the road this Saturday who don't barrel into a family coming home from Grandma's house. Believe me, I learned first hand. The idea that all drunk drivers kill families is silly.

The logic of the 2nd statement mirrors the logic of the first. See the problem with the logic to both statements? Just because not every PWCC auction is shilled does not excuse or minimize the fact that a significant subset of PWCC auctions are shilled. If that doesn't bother you, bid away.

[/QUOTE]

The thing about logic is that it isn't an opinion. As Adam said, your own experience with it doesn't prove that it doesn't happen. Any reasonable person examining bidding patterns in PWCC auctions would believe that shilling is taking place. In addition to that, the only reason to hide bidding is to make it harder for people to see what is going on. My own approach to PWCC is to both snipe and bid less than I would with a better seller...though a lower level addict would probably avoid them all together.

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

There are plenty of cards on PWCC that don't get a great price. Believe me, I learned first hand. The idea that all of the auctions are shilled is silly.

I NEVER SAID THERE ARE NOT PWCC SHILLED AUCTIONS. I said they aren't ALL shilled. Which was relevant to the OP's comment that he feels he personally got a good deal on a card.

I assume a decent number of the 8 billion items listed on eBay every day are shilled. Including PWCC. And yes, despite my understanding that many of PWCC auctions are likely shilled by the consignor, his friends and family, or others, I continue to occasionally bid on a card there. Because I do research on what I want to buy. And I know what a fair price is. Same reason I continue to buy cars from dealers and nice bottles of wine from greedy steak chain restaurants. Because I do my research and make peace with how much I will pay beforehand.

Sheesh.

[perezfan]

Brent has been known to instruct his staff to shill. Just on principle... Don't do business with crooks.

To support them is to perpetuate the fraud. Even if you think you got a good deal on the card, another one will surface... guaranteed.

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

Not a PSA 5, LOL. It's SGC 5.5 and you got worked for $300 by the PWCC shillers:mad :

I would have sold you this for the same price.

The SGC slab was a bonus for me (as I'm one of "those" guys) and I needed the midgrade to fill a hole in my EX-EXMT set.

If you are offering that PSA 7 for $750 - I'll take it.....