Best lefty off all time? My vote is Koufax!

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

But if you're using WAR, looking at it per innings pitched (rather than per season) is the best indicator. And Pedro bests all those guys there.

Thing is, innings pitched is a skill. Throwing 40 extra innings every year - and 7 extra seasons - is a monstrous gap to overcome. If all we care about is WAR per inning then you end up with some closer getting ranked highly.

I do agree with the guy above saying Pedro's 1.74 vs Roger's 3.70 for ERA might be the most amazing pitching accomplishment ever.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Tabe

Thing is, innings pitched is a skill. Throwing 40 extra innings every year - and 7 extra seasons - is a monstrous gap to overcome. If all we care about is WAR per inning then you end up with some closer getting ranked highly.

I do agree with the guy above saying Pedro's 1.74 vs Roger's 3.70 for ERA might be the most amazing pitching accomplishment ever.

Closers wouldn't have to be included in any comparison of starting pitchers at all. I don't know where that even came from. Naturally WAR/inning is a similar ratio concept to someone's ERA, and it's not like anyone would dismiss ERA as a factor for ranking starting pitchers (nor should they, just because it's a ratio that can be applied to any pitcher). You just dismiss relievers' participation in that discussion.

The rest is once again the dominance or talent vs longevity and durability argument that's somewhat subjective. I'm fine with people preferring Johnson, Maddux, or Clemens to Pedro because of it (or even considering them "better", though I'd disagree).

But that doesn't mean that Pedro still can't be considered the most talented or effective pitcher of them all. Especially if you value outs and winning more than innings as a "skill"