Factory certified autograph question

[mrmopar]

I have questioned a few certified cards lately, mainly because of these stories I have seen posted about forgeries. I appreciate the info, but MOST of the forgeries discussed are items outside of my typical spending range anyway. Jeter, Mantle, Williams, DiMaggio, etc. It is very possible, maybe likely, that some of the better stuff I got in the early ebay days could be fake. I have not tried to buy any bigger name, expensive uncertified autographs in many years now. That would be guys like DiMaggio, Williams, Mantle, Wilt Chamberlain, etc. Most I got before the players died, which is not a foolproof factor, but the forgeries certainly tend to increase when the supply dries up completely.

Two certified cards I recently took a leap of faith on were cheap enough to not feel too terrible if they turned out wrong. I don't want to imply that I don't mind buying fakes if they are cheap enough. I just felt that these two were likely real and the risk low (but there), but I was not 100% sure. I posted one and never got a conclusive answer. The other I just went ahead and bought w/o other's feedback.

One was a Frank Robinson buyback, the other a Juan Marichal buyback. Both Topps.

[bigfanNY]

I know you said very specifically not to say generically "Do your Homework" So how about I suggest the type of homework you should do based on how a number of cards that Chris and other members here and on other collectors boards "found out" that Certified Autographed cards were first being counterfeit and then Forged signatures were being applied.
I put together a display of Certified Autographed Modern 500 HR Hitters a few years ago and I routinely buy and sell Certified autographed cards from Topps, Donruss, Upper Deck, etc. So if I am considering a card one of the first things I do is look at previous sales in ebay. I am looking to guage current price and to see uf a large number of the card has recently come to market and if one or a small group of sellers is selling them. Because that is a RED FLAG!!. I then compare older sales to current ones to see if the cards and the signatures match up. I will also look at other cards of that same player to see if the Auto's match up or if there is a glut of any of their certified autographed cards. And understand this process works for Autographs of all sports. Because fakes have been created in All Sports. I might also do a quick google search on the card to see if anybody has posted any red flags. And last I would post a picture of the card here and ask for help if I still needed it.
Hope this helps
Jonathan

[JRS123490]

I think the Archives series (which I believe you're referring to) is a safe bet. So far from the last few years, I have not seen any that I would say are forged. I have seen many, many fake Mays, Pujols etc...where the forger will peel an older Topps hologram off the back of a cheaper card, and place it on a forged card and put it into a clip case with a sticker sealing it to make it look like an authentic buyback. Also, Topps claims that they have witnesses present at all signings. Whether or not this is 100% true, I can't say for certain, but it seems like they are pretty good about it.

[homerunhitter]

I think I’ll just collect signed cancelled checks!’ That seems like a safer alternative at least o know those are not forged. I believe signed checks are as close to an authentic autograph as one can get. Your guys thoughts on signed checks? Thanks

[Klrdds]

Originally Posted by homerunhitter

I think I’ll just collect signed cancelled checks!’ That seems like a safer alternative at least o know those are not forged. I believe signed checks are as close to an authentic autograph as one can get. Your guys thoughts on signed checks? Thanks

Al
I think that is the best thing to do if you want that to be your collecting niche, and to have some piece of mind. Many players are available on checks and most are relatively affordable (under $1000.00 ) even for HoFers.
Only legal documents , contracts , and checks are the safest bet these days. At one time I had over 175 checks in my collection and I never worried about authenticity; HOWEVER, about 8-10 years ago with the advent of really good printers I did get a few bad ones that were laser printed . What I would now if I'm primarily going to buy the checks from ebay or a dealer is ask for front and back images of the check , look for the check tear marks from the checkbook on the check , and lastly search ebay for that check of that player and pay particular attention to see if that check number is listed on ebay as well or far sale elsewhere. Call me paranoid but there are scammers everywhere using all the tools available to them.

[homerunhitter]

Thank you for this wonderful advice. I appreciate it. It gives me a lot to think about as I decide which way to go with my collecting.

I feel I should just throw my hands up and say I’m done with collecting WAY to many forgers and fraud in our hobby. Who would of thought a cancelled bank check of all things would be duplicated on a high end printer? I never thought of that before but you are so right. It seems like nothing is safe (or authentic) in our hobby anymore. I never thought I’d see the day that we would have to worry or second guess that a factory topps Autograph would not be real. Thank you so much for opening my eyes to this (in regards to signed checks) as I always thought signed checks were 100% authentic.

[Klrdds]

Forgeries are not new to the autograph collecting world. Forgers have been around as long as people have been signing their names on anything. The difference is that IMO there are more forgers than before , more materials / items to sign to forge , more methods to forge , smarter forgers , and more unsuspecting buyers with any amount of money willing to buy autographs for any amount of money and of anyone they want ( you don't have to forge items that cost hundreds or thousands of dollars anymore to be successful ), many many diverse selling platforms are available, also at times there is very little recourse against forgers because they rarely are the original seller and can claim ignorance as a defense at times, and, finally, there are TPAs that are sometimes a forgers best friend.
That's just one reason among others I started selling parts of my autograph collection about 5 years ago.
Good Luck on your decision .