Production Estimates / Print Run Archive

[seanofjapan]

Originally Posted by insidethewrapper

Here's what I found:

Ah thanks a lot for posting that, I knew I had seen something like that 28 years ago. Guess I got the years mixed up, 1987 instead of 1985, but I was pretty sure it had been in relation to 1992 Donruss.

[Farm_kid]

2002 Donruss Diamond Kings -estimated 41,000 Hobby Boxes based on one Numbered Diamond Cut Auto/Jersey/Bat card per hobby box.

[homerunderby]

Got an interesting lead off an old thread on another board. In the early 80's wax and cello packs had a contest card which told both how many prizes and the odds. Off of that you can extrapolate out some figures that will give some idea of the relationship in print runs over the years.

1981 Topps: (Wax Only) 3,012,050 prizes, 1:17 packs x 15 cards-pack/792 cards* 970,000 sets in wax

1982 Topps: No contest

1983 Topps: (Wax/Cello) 285,000 prizes, 1:140 packs x19cards-pack /792 cards 957,196 sets

1984 Topps (Wax/Cello) 20,000 batting gloves, 1:2,700 packs x19cards-pack 1,295,000 sets

1985 Topps (Wax/Cello) 2,000 fielding gloves, 1:25,000 packsx19cards-pack 1,200,000 sets

1986-1991 Topps Contest had no odds, based on sent-in entries

1992 Topps (All Packs) 6 grand prizes, 1:41,666,667 packsx21cards-pack 6,628,000 sets(!!!)

*- though there were only 726 cards in the set, 66 were double printed.

Where the contest cards came in multiple pack types I estimated the amount of cards per pack across the print run. My presumption was that wax is the great majority of the print run versus cello (and rack, etc for 1992).

This leaves out rack packs, vending boxes, and factory sets for the years they were produced. But it does give a starting point. If you held a gun to my head I'd add 25% to the 1981-83 print runs, and maybe 40% to the 1984-85 for the other packaging.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1993 Stadium Club: 1st Day Production: 2,000 sets 1:24 packsx14cards-pack 100,000 sets

[JUrsaner]

wow great stuff! Let me take a look through it and add it to the list

do you have pictures of the contest cards with the odds?

[Hooliganlv]

I would love to know the Leaf print runs in the mid 80s. The pop report for an 87 Bo Jackson and 87 Barry Bonds in PSA 10 are only in the 90s.

In contrast, their 87 Topps Tiffany PSA 10s are in the 300s.

[dave416]

A question about the 1993 Finest Refractors - the PSA pop shows 282 for the Frank Thomas Refractor (#102) alone - could there be that many re-submissions? And would that many of them have been submitted?

EDIT - looks like there was a 2015 thread concerning this with crossovers and mislabels considered the most likely explanation.

[homerunderby]

Originally Posted by dave416

A question about the 1993 Finest Refractors - the PSA pop shows 282 for the Frank Thomas Refractor (#102) alone - could there be that many re-submissions? And would that many of them have been submitted?

EDIT - looks like there was a 2015 thread concerning this with crossovers and mislabels considered the most likely explanation.

The number cited in 1993 for the Finest Refractors are 241 each, which came 1:9 packs if I remember correctly.

[Bigdaddy]

No hard numbers to add to the thread, but I can give some memories that should provide a check on some of the trends.

1984 Donruss were advertised to be produced in lower numbers than the previous years. This 'scarcity' increased demand and they were harder to find in 1984 than Topps or Fleer. This seems to be reflected in your Donruss print runs numbers. After 1984, Donruss went back up in production, flooding the market by the late 80s.

For Fleer, production (supposedly) took a dip in 1988 after steady increases in the previous years.

Topps, well, they kept the presses running 24/7 all through the '80s, until they literally used all the cardboard in the western hemisphere in 1987.

Upper Deck's first print run in 1989 was initially thought to be 'limited', but like an Artesian well, they kept showing up on shelves. I have heard that they even specifically printed sheets of Griffey that year to make sure every living person on earth had a GJr RC.

All hearsay, I know.

[JUrsaner]

Originally Posted by Hooliganlv

I would love to know the Leaf print runs in the mid 80s. The pop report for an 87 Bo Jackson and 87 Barry Bonds in PSA 10 are only in the 90s.

In contrast, their 87 Topps Tiffany PSA 10s are in the 300s.

I'd also be interested in this

Slowed down on this but going to add those sets to the list so I remember to come back to it

[Hooliganlv]

Originally Posted by JUrsaner

I'd also be interested in this

Slowed down on this but going to add those sets to the list so I remember to come back to it

I saw someone post this in a FB comment. It’s not verified but at least something to go off of for 87 Leaf:

“I was looking to see what a 1987 Leaf case looked like, but all I could find was a 10 box case with 8 regular boxes and 2 Leaf boxes. Does anyone know if this is the only way they came? If so, that’s a 1:4 Leaf / Donruss ratio just in those cases alone. Then you have regular 20 box cases of Donruss on top of that. If you do a 10 box mixed for every 20 box regular then you are at a 1:15 ratio without taking in to account Racks and Cellos. If the ratio of 1:15 is close, which I think it is more like 1:50, then Leaf boxes are very undervalued in the current market.”

The ratio of submissions to PSA is 1:11.9. 9,222 Leaf vs 110,089 Donruss.