Glory of Their Times

[todeen]

Originally Posted by rats60

So all the members of the Underground Railroad were racists? It doesn't matter that whites were risking their lives, and sometimes dying, helping blacks. Branch Rickey must have been a racist too. How about Pee Wee Reese?

I'm a Christian man. The seed of hatred and discrimination lies within us all.

There has been and always will be the ability to accept one minority without accepting them all. There were many a white abolitionist who thought that removing Native Americans from their families and reservations and forcing them into schools far away so that they could assimilate into white culture was best for them and their kind.

And further, being an abolitionist didn't mean one stood for equality in all segments of society. Being an abolitionist meant that you didn't believe one man could subjugate and enslave another. Abolitionists weren't advocating interracial marriage. Many didn't even advocate women's right to vote.

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[rats60]

Originally Posted by todeen

I'm a Christian man. The seed of hatred and discrimination lies within us all.

There has been and always will be the ability to accept one minority without accepting them all. There were many a white abolitionist who thought that removing Native Americans from their families and reservations and forcing them into schools far away so that they could assimilate into white culture was best for them and their kind.

And further, being an abolitionist didn't mean one stood for equality in all segments of society. Being an abolitionist meant that you didn't believe one man could subjugate and enslave another. Abolitionists weren't advocating interracial marriage. Many didn't even advocate women's right to vote.

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Some maybe, but ALL? All who were risking their lives were still racists? Isn't that diminishing what real racism is? People today like to throw around that term to make themselves superior to others they disagree with. Racism injured and killed real humans. It is a word that shouldn't be used lightly.

[todeen]

Originally Posted by rats60

People today like to throw around that term to make themselves superior to others they disagree with. Racism injured and killed real humans. It is a word that shouldn't be used lightly.

Racism is not treating a group of people equally because of race or heritage. One does not need to burn a cross or lynch a man to be racist. When Hank Aaron couldn't sleep in the same hotel as his teammates was that not racism? When he had to wash his uniform at the black laundry on the other side of town, was that not racism? So then his teammates who said, "gosh Hank, I'm sorry, but that's just the way things are," don't they bare some burden for the problem continuing? They aren't just innocent bystanders. They could sleep elsewhere, they could eat elsewhere, but they didn't.

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[rhettyeakley]

Why are hijacking this thread and making it about whether or not long dead men that were raised and lived during times many of us were not born in either were or were not racist to some degree or another?

There will be no consensus reached here people! We don’t know the answer, nor will we ever know. It is like watching Don Quixote attacking a windmill!

[todeen]

Originally Posted by rhettyeakley

There will be no consensus reached here people! We don’t know the answer, nor will we ever know. It is like watching Don Quixote attacking a windmill!

Nice comment. I like the Don Quixote reference. I'll stop.

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[tschock]

Originally Posted by rats60

Some maybe, but ALL? All who were risking their lives were still racists? Isn't that diminishing what real racism is? People today like to throw around that term to make themselves superior to others they disagree with. Racism injured and killed real humans. It is a word that shouldn't be used lightly.

Of course it is. The statement akin to 'everyone is a racist' diminishes racism to the extent of saying every person alive is breathing. If indeed, everyone is a racist, what is the point of even being concerned with racism at all? Beyond being a bludgeon for preferential usage of the term.

[carlsonjok]

Originally Posted by todeen

I'm a Christian man. The seed of hatred and discrimination lies within us all.

There has been and always will be the ability to accept one minority without accepting them all. There were many a white abolitionist who thought that removing Native Americans from their families and reservations and forcing them into schools far away so that they could assimilate into white culture was best for them and their kind.

And further, being an abolitionist didn't mean one stood for equality in all segments of society. Being an abolitionist meant that you didn't believe one man could subjugate and enslave another. Abolitionists weren't advocating interracial marriage. Many didn't even advocate women's right to vote.

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I think this is the salient point. I'm not a particularly active member here, nor am I anything approaching a competent baseball historian, but I have been blessed/cursed to have to walk this earth observing and evaluating my every move (ISTJ, represent!) Stereotyping is a common heuristic for dealing with unfamiliar situations. So, the question isn't whether a person is prejudiced or not, because everyone carries around some level of prejudice. The question is whether we can recognize that prejudice within ourselves and compartmentalize it away from our interactions with the world in general, and individuals specifically.

So, think of Cobb as Schrödinger's racist.

[Case12]

Originally Posted by carlsonjok

I think this is the salient point. I'm not a particularly active member here, nor am I anything approaching a competent baseball historian, but I have been blessed/cursed to have to walk this earth observing and evaluating my every move (ISTJ, represent!) Stereotyping is a common heuristic for dealing with unfamiliar situations. So, the question isn't whether a person is prejudiced or not, because everyone carries around some level of prejudice. The question is whether we can recognize that prejudice within ourselves and compartmentalize it away from our interactions with the world in general, and individuals specifically.

So, think of Cobb as Schrödinger's racist.

Well said....

[todeen]

Originally Posted by carlsonjok

So, the question isn't whether a person is prejudiced or not, because everyone carries around some level of prejudice. The question is whether we can recognize that prejudice within ourselves and compartmentalize it away from our interactions with the world in general, and individuals specifically.

Tschock, your answer was given by carlsonjok, who said it very well.

Or, if you're a bible believer, it's to realize your imperfection, to begin to follow the Lord's commands and to change your habits (to love thy neighbor as thy self, or to follow the golden rule), and to accept the redeeming power of Christ.

I'm sorry to hijack this thread like someone said earlier. I really like theory, theology, and philosophy and the attempts to turn theory into real life application.... and the difficulties this presents in trying to accomplish it.

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