Team Issues and Rookie Cards

[Peter_Spaeth]

Post-war, but anyhow I would call Carlton and Seaver rookie year issues, not sure what I would call Murray, pre-rookie I guess although to me that connotes a minor league card.

[triwak]

Great cards, Peter!!

[KMayUSA6060]

Originally Posted by topcat61

I've been curious lately about larger team issue premiums (like 1940's Brooklyn Dodgers, Cubs and Red Sox) -could some of these be considered the rookie cards of players like Pee Wee Reese or Duke Snider?

What constitutes a rookie card and how do collectors feel about team issued cards and premiums?

My own feeling is that the 8x10's, or odd sized stuff is difficult to display, but on the flipside, they're mostly cheap and provide a great way to obtain an otherwise difficult or expensive player.

Thanks.

You'll notice in the thread that Leon shared, the Veeck rookie is considered the 1952 St. Louis Browns Postcards. I believe that's outdated, and his actual rookie is considered the 1948 Cleveland TEAM ISSUE.

So yes, I would consider team issues to be the rookie card. Additionally, there's a large debate surrounding Babe Ruth's rookie card, whether or not the more regional Baltimore News(?) issue is his rookie or the nationally-released Sporting News(?) is his rookie. I would consider this to be a similar debate, and if you consider the Team Issue cards to be their rookie cards, perfect. Do what makes you happy with your collection.

Originally Posted by Leon

There have been numerous discussions, on the forum, over the years and the only consensus is there is no consensus.
Here is an older thread concerning rookies...

http://forum.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=141603


.

This thread has been bookmarked in my HoF spreadsheet for a while. I refer back to it constantly.

[uyu906]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Post-war, but anyhow I would call Carlton and Seaver rookie year issues, not sure what I would call Murray, pre-rookie I guess although to me that connotes a minor league card.

Murray played all of the 1977 season with the Baltimore Orioles. That club issued photo is from Murray's rookie year. Topps, of course, did not print his rookie "card" until 1978.

[bcbgcbrcb]

Good choices, Peter. Seaver - Rookie Card, Murray - Rookie Card, Carlton - I think is a similar size to a postcard but I don’t recall it being one, either way, I think Rookie Card works there too.

[bcbgcbrcb]

Sorry, Kyle. The ‘48 Veeck is an oversize paper premium and in no way meets the definition of a card so, therefore, it cannot be a Rookie Card. It is a Veeck Rookie and maybe earliest collectible.

[h2oya311]

Here's my checklist for Veeck:

1930s Photo (High School Portrait)
1935 Press Photo (w/ Eleanor Raymond)
1943 Press Photo
1944 Press Photo
1945 Milwaukee Brewers Team Postcard
1946 Cleveland Team Photo Postcard
1948 Cleveland Team Issue
1948 Cleveland Team Issue 4-on-1 Picture Pack
1952 St. Louis Browns Postcards

I'd consider the '48 Cleveland Team Issue his individual rookie. Heck, SGC grades them...not cardboard stock, but earliest checklisted and standard issue with his image. Good in my book. Here are a few of my Veeck's:

[JLange]

I count Larry Doby's 1947 Cleveland Indians Picture Pack photo as his true rookie card, or "earliest collectible" is probably a better way to say it. As much as I like the 1949 Bowman and 1949 Leaf cards, those came out 2yrs later! Really hard to argue with that.

[Copa7]

So this was a topic of conversation in another forum.

I brought attention to the Russian pro hockey league which featured standard size hockey cards with Alex Ovechkin. To me, this was easily in every definition of rookie card.

While other players have debuted in leagues outside the big 4 - Warren Moon in the CFL and other like Jim Kelly and Reggie White in the USFL.

The point best presented here, is collect what you like.

[KMayUSA6060]

Originally Posted by h2oya311

Here's my checklist for Veeck:

1930s Photo (High School Portrait)
1935 Press Photo (w/ Eleanor Raymond)
1943 Press Photo
1944 Press Photo
1945 Milwaukee Brewers Team Postcard
1946 Cleveland Team Photo Postcard
1948 Cleveland Team Issue
1948 Cleveland Team Issue 4-on-1 Picture Pack
1952 St. Louis Browns Postcards

I'd consider the '48 Cleveland Team Issue his individual rookie. Heck, SGC grades them...not cardboard stock, but earliest checklisted and standard issue with his image. Good in my book. Here are a few of my Veeck's:

Impressive checklist.