T206 Reference / Reflections.....Tuesday Nite Trivia

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by Sean

Is one of the 12 Merkle?

Sean

I'm surprised....for you know Merkle is not one of Exclusive 12 guys in the 460-only Series.

Your amazing Merkle run does NOT have a red HINDU card. Nor will it ever.....since the only
subjects in the 460-only Series printed with red HINDU backs are the Exclusive 12 subjects.

TED Z
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[Ronnie73]

Wether your just getting started with collecting T206's or you've been collecting for many years, we can all agree that there are many ways to collect the Monster. Many collectors don't like T206's because they are not rare. Sorry but it's true. There are always many to choose from when making a purchase. There are probably between 100 and 200 complete 520 sets in collections. These are sets with any advertisement backs but usually Piedmont and Sweet Caporal which are most common.

So here's where it gets interesting. A 520 card set can go from common to difficult just by eliminating Piedmont and Sweet Caporal backs and chasing the more difficult backs. There may be a few of these specialty sets already completed and a small group of other collectors currently working on them.

Now, say you want to go from difficult to extremely rare. Lets say you eliminate Piedmont, Sweet Caporal, Polar Bear, Old Mill, and Sovereign. Well 520 cards is not possible. There are 36 cards that would be missing from your set according to T206resourse. There are also 88 cards where Hindu Brown is your only choice. Here is the list of the missing 36 cards. Maybe some of these cards can be found and removed from this list.

Southern League
Jack Bastian
Bill Hart
Jimmy Hart
Frank King
Harry Lentz
Molly Miller
Al Orth
Charles Seitz
Carlos Smith
Dolly Stark
Tony Thebo
Foley White

Polar Bear Only
Ray Demmitt St. Louis
Bill O'Hara St. Louis

EPDG Possible but not confirmed
George Brown Washington
Ty Cobb Bat On Shoulder
Ty Cobb Portrait - Green
Wid Conroy Fielding
Sam Crawford Throwing
Dode Criss
Bill Dahlen Brooklyn
Jiggs Donohue
Kid Elberfeld Portrait - Washington
Ed Hahn
Fred Jacklitsch
Red Kleinow NY With Bat
John McGraw Finger In Air
Danny Murphy Throwing
Simon Nicholls Hands On Knees
Harry Niles
Rube Oldring Fielding
Frank Smith Chicago - F. Smith
Jake Stahl No Glove Shows
Rube Waddell Throwing
Jimmy Williams

Tolstoi Possible but not confirmed
Bill O'Hara New York

So bottom line, the question is, how common are T206's? The answer: It all depends on how you collect them. For those who want to know my current numbers, here they are.

No Piedmont or Sweet Caporal 494/520
No Piedmont, Sweet Caporal, Polar Bear, Old Mill, or Sovereign 264/484

[t206kid]

Great post by Ron. There are so many different ways to parse the set. I'll post my progress...

No Piedmont or Sweet Caporal 431/520
No Piedmont, Sweet Caporal, Polar Bear, Old Mill, or Sovereign 184/484

I think it's also worth noting removing PB/OM/Sov from the set eliminates some of the best cards in the set! Green Cobb and Bat on, Waddell throwing, and Elberfeld.

Plus, there are a whole host of cards where a Sovereign 150 is actually more difficult than a Hindu. On those, I actually prefer a Sov150 over the Hindu.

Also, I've built this from the top to the bottom. So my first goal was tackling the expensive and difficult HOF/variations, and now I'm on the hunt for the various commons I need.

[tedzan]

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE......Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *





In conversations throughout the years with collectors who own (or have owned) the T206 Honus Wagner card, it's interesting to find out that a fair number of these cards
have originated from the NY - Long Island area.
The majority of the Wagner cards are SWEET CAPORAL 150, Factory #25. Also, some of them are SWEET CAPORAL 150, Factory #30. And, a handful are PIEDMONT 150.
Conventional thinking is that none of the PIEDMONT Wagner's were inserted in Cigarette packs. Indeed, the PSA Wagner was cut from an uncut sheet (or panel). I bring
up this subject because I have a theory..... OH NO ! …..Another theory by Ted Z

Consider this....Joseph Palmer Knapp, the founder of the American Lithographic Company (ALC), had a vacation home in Suffolk County, Long Island (NY). Therefore, I'm
suggesting...when Wagner forced ATC to discontinue printing his image, ALC was in the process of printing up many 150 Series cards (which included Wagner and Plank).
So what happened to all the Wagner cards (approx. 75 - 90 exist) ? Were they dis-card-ed (excuse the pun) by ALC ? Or perhaps, Mr. Knapp took a bunch of them out to
Long Island and handed them out to his children, and their friends or neighbors. If so, these Wagner's eventually found they way into NY residents' collections.

Let's hear of your experiences, or thoughts, regarding the T206 Wagner card ?





TED Z
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[RCMcKenzie]

Ted, I took a quick look at the psa pop report...

Cy Young port...sc 150/25.....6
Bobby Wallace...sc 150/25.....5
Honus Wagner...sc 150/25.....4

Young sc 150/30 .... 42
Wallace sc 150/30.... 27
Wagner sc 150/30.... 2

It's not a scientific sample, but it's interesting that the 2 random hofers I picked compare almost equally for factory 25, but not factory 30.

[Ronnie73]

Ted, that's an interesting thought. If it's true, then finding a Wagner in a pack would have been even more difficult than thought. I'm still saving up for a Wagner of my own. Time to go door to door in Long Island.

[Rhotchkiss]

Ted, just curious, what premium (if any), do you place on a Piedmont-backed Wagner or Plank vs the more common Sweet Caporal backs? When I say “premium”, I mean in a general sense- value, prestige, etc. How many Piedmont Wagners and Planks are there?

Or better General question - do you think the back “matters” when it comes to Wagner and Plank, and if so, how much so with the much rarer Piedmont (which probably all should be A) vs Sweet Cap?

[tedzan]

Hi Ryan

Generally speaking....I don't think most T206 collectors care which back is on a Wagner or Plank, they are just happy to get one (or both) of these cards.

Now, "dudes" like me would prefer to have the PIEDMONT version of these two T206 cards (so, I can complete my all - PIEDMONT set).

Besides, the big $$$$$$ associated with these two T206's is way above my "pay-grade".

I'm content with my SWEET CAP 150, Factory #30 Eddie Plank (graded "A").

"A" for Awesome, and Affordable



TED Z
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