Let's discuss conspiracies and a billion dollar fraud

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by SMPEP

When you buy a card for $1, all you can lose is $1. And if I do, my heirs suffer - but I enjoyed having the card and I made the money - so that's a bad break for them.

Ditto. And this thread needs another card image



"In 1955, there were 77,263,127 male American human beings. And every one of them in his heart of hearts would have given two arms, a leg and his collection of Davy Crockett iron-ons to be Teddy Ballgame."

[drcy]

As I've said before I anticipate pricing changes. I think some will leave the hobby or not sink as much money in, certainly not into "high grade" graded cards. Many people who otherwise would have won't enter the hobby, or enter with the same amount of "investment" money, when the learn the hobby is rife with corruption, wrong grades, illegal activity and entities that actually enable such behavior. Certainly, skepticism of grades and graders will rise tremendously. Further, even if conservation and alterations are more hobby accepted and normalized, I find it hard to believe that someone will still pay the same exponentially more for a 10 over a 9, or a 9 over an 8, because one altered card was altered microscopically better than another altered card. Even if you love altered cards, you're not going to pay an extra $100,000 for a card because a wrinkled was spooned better-- especially when, for the same effect, you could get the lower grade card and have it altered to your liking and higher grade for $200.

No question the normalization of alterations, and even acceptance of it, will reduce the grade rarity of many cards (as more and more cards will become "better and better" condition), which will lower prices there. That idea is borrowed from Barry Sloate and his keen insight.

The new knowledge about the capabilities of graders, and the prevalence of altered cards, will change how cards are considered and thus priced.

But there will also be a cottage industry for cards that have not been altered, and more knowledge about which cards are altered and which are not WILL rise substantially with time.

[mechanicalman]

Good idea, Adam. Let's show some cardboard we LOVE.

Some recent pick-ups on the way. Purchased from a reputable establishment (REA) for prices that reflect strong demand in the marketplace.

I'm well aware of what's going on and have changed my habits accordingly, but I will continue to be an active and positive participant in the hobby. Sorry, Chuck.

[Exhibitman]

Back at ya, with your avatar:



Got the card when I was a kid; got the card signed at one of Gehringer's last autograph sessions.

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Back at ya, with your avatar:



Got the card when I was a kid; got the card signed at one of Gehringer's last autograph sessions.

One of the prettiest signatures in baseball. I love that card and the story behind it. Just another reason to love collecting.

[bmcnutt]

As I've said before, I'd like to do away with giving the cards a numerical grade and just see a grade such as "Authentic". This would be a plus for collectors IMO. It would cut down on the overpriced cards. I know PSA & others offer this option, but as long as the numerical grade is around, especially for vintage cards, then the fraud, such as "trimming" for a higher grade, will continue to thrive. What would be the point in trimming a card if it wasn't going to get a numerical grade?

[Peter_Spaeth]

There is a better chance of the Earth colliding with Mars than the TPGs ditching numerical grades.

[drcy]

I think it should be obvious that, however the money comes and goes and however alterations are accepted or not, "highest grade" (quotes intentional) will become more plentiful and go down in value. Like McDonald's hamburgers, they're being made to order, plus most people will have caught on that the conditions are often if not mostly not real. Will they be collected and valued? Sure. Will they be valued at the same rate compared to when they were rarer and people thought unaltered? Of course not.

Peter Spaeth correctly pointed that some formerly very rarely centered cards have become readily available because people out there are "centering" them for the customers.

PSA Registry investor types are in a conundrum. They want to protect the status quo, but also know that the status quo means their precious grade rarities will become less and less (and less) rare and will devaluate that way . . . Adding to the quandary is they also fret about how many of their registry cards are altered, and how many will be outed as altered as time goes by.

PSA also is in a quandary. On one hand they want to be able to better identify altered cards, but on the other hands they don't know what to do with that ability vis a vis all those millions of dollars worth of cards in holders that are mislabelled.

Who knows, maybe it will end up being the wealthy registry big wigs who end up suing PSA.

[Leon]

+1 It is their gravy train. Unfortunately it seems they often really suck at their job.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

There is a better chance of the Earth colliding with Mars than the TPGs ditching numerical grades.