Is CC Sabathia a Hall of Famer?

[Tabe]

My vote on CC is no. 9 seasons of 3.90 or higher ERA. Yeah, he's got 250 wins but he got there by averaging 8 wins a year since 2013.

Not a terrible selection but no.

[Yastrzemski Sports]

CC is pitching in a hitters ballpark, against a DH, in one of the most hitter friendly ballparks in baseball. At the same time, he has earned a roster spot playing on one of the most competitive teams in one of the most demanding markets in baseball. He is not compiling numbers. He is a productive and important part of the team. He has a career war which places him in company with many other HOF pitchers. ERA does not tell the whole story. He is almost 100 wins over .500 with an ERA+ of 117. Combined with a CY and a WS he will probably be a first ballot guy.

[packs]

Originally Posted by Yastrzemski Sports

CC is pitching in a hitters ballpark, against a DH, in one of the most hitter friendly ballparks in baseball. At the same time, he has earned a roster spot playing on one of the most competitive teams in one of the most demanding markets in baseball. He is not compiling numbers. He is a productive and important part of the team. He has a career war which places him in company with many other HOF pitchers. ERA does not tell the whole story. He is almost 100 wins over .500 with an ERA+ of 117. Combined with a CY and a WS he will probably be a first ballot guy.

First ballot? I'm going to say a name that no one associates with the HOF but in my opinion is a name I'd rather have on the rubber than CC: Tim Hudson. He also won almost (89) 100 more games than he lost, his ERA is lower than CC at 3.49, his ERA+ is higher at 120 and his best season (7.5 WAR in 2003) is better than CC's Cy Young season (6.3 in 2007). Even Hudson's second best season in 2002 (WAR of 6.9) was better than any single Sabathia season.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by packs

First ballot? I'm going to say a name that no one associates with the HOF but in my opinion is a name I'd rather have on the rubber than CC: Tim Hudson. He also won almost (89) 100 more games than he lost, his ERA is lower than CC at 3.49, his ERA+ is higher at 120 and his best season (7.5 WAR in 2003) is better than CC's Cy Young season (6.3 in 2007). Even Hudson's second best season in 2002 (WAR of 6.9) was better than any single Sabathia season.

As much as it pains me to agree with Packs (who is using WAR in a discussion???!!!) he's got a point. Hudson really was consistently good longer than CC and his peak was higher.

Now Packs, about Corey Dickerson...

[packs]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

As much as it pains me to agree with Packs (who is using WAR in a discussion???!!!) he's got a point. Hudson really was consistently good longer than CC and his peak was higher.

Now Packs, about Corey Dickerson...

Haha I've always thought Hudson has been criminally overlooked and he's been one of my favorite players since he came into the league. I loved watching him pitch.

[Orioles1954]

Tim Hudson was a great ball player. He did rack up a lot of numbers in a pitching friendly park but was a “compiler” (just kidding) toward the latter part of his career.

[packs]

Originally Posted by Orioles1954

Tim Hudson was a great ball player. He did rack up a lot of numbers in a pitching friendly park but was a “compiler” (just kidding) toward the latter part of his career.

Haha it was his last three seasons that killed his HOF case. If not for them he he would have been (correct me if I'm wrong) the only pitcher other than Babe Ruth to pitch at least 10 seasons and never have a losing record. Except for two of those three last seasons!

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Orioles1954

Tim Hudson was a great ball player. He did rack up a lot of numbers in a pitching friendly park but was a “compiler” (just kidding) toward the latter part of his career.

Turner field was pretty neutral with it's ballpark factor bouncing around from year to year on either side of "1" which is in essence, no affect.

[Yastrzemski Sports]

Originally Posted by packs

First ballot? I'm going to say a name that no one associates with the HOF but in my opinion is a name I'd rather have on the rubber than CC: Tim Hudson. He also won almost (89) 100 more games than he lost, his ERA is lower than CC at 3.49, his ERA+ is higher at 120 and his best season (7.5 WAR in 2003) is better than CC's Cy Young season (6.3 in 2007). Even Hudson's second best season in 2002 (WAR of 6.9) was better than any single Sabathia season.

Hudson had a very nice career. The reason no one associated him with the HOF is that he has isn’t going there. He has 222 wins and 2000 strikeouts. CC has 250 wins and 3000 K to go with the CY. If you are comparing a guy with 2000k to a guy with 3000k that’s where the argument ends.
CCs best season were 19-7, 3.21 and 21-7, 3.18. He also had two more 19 win seasons. Also, CC had a war of 7.2 in 2008 which was split with Cleveland and Milwaukee. CC is retiring at the end of this season. I would guess he and Ichiro will go in together - because at this time they are the only 2 players retiring who are worth voting for. There is always the possibility he will have to wait another year but I doubt it.

[packs]

Originally Posted by Yastrzemski Sports

Hudson had a very nice career. The reason no one associated him with the HOF is that he has isn’t going there. He has 222 wins and 2000 strikeouts. CC has 250 wins and 3000 K to go with the CY. If you are comparing a guy with 2000k to a guy with 3000k that’s where the argument ends.
CCs best season were 19-7, 3.21 and 21-7, 3.18. He also had two more 19 win seasons. Also, CC had a war of 7.2 in 2008 which was split with Cleveland and Milwaukee. CC is retiring at the end of this season. I would guess he and Ichiro will go in together - because at this time they are the only 2 players retiring who are worth voting for. There is always the possibility he will have to wait another year but I doubt it.

The stats you're bringing up for CC are compiler stats. Without hanging around as a below average pitcher since 2013 and putting up one decent season in 2017, CC doesn't sniff 250 wins or 3000 K's.