Is CC Sabathia a Hall of Famer?

[MVSNYC]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

If Bartolo had won 3 more would he get in, with his 4.12 lifetime ERA? I doubt it. I think it's still an overall assessment, but I agree CC should make it.

I totally agree it's an overall assessment. And as such, CC should get in.

My 250 comment (which others above said the same), is pointing out one (huge) aspect of his game...not the only one for review.

[Davidlisa]

C.C. was dominant for years, his numbers are good and in my opinion with the watering down of the Hall of Fame, he gets in.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by Davidlisa

C.C. was dominant for years, his numbers are good and in my opinion with the watering down of the Hall of Fame, he gets in.

AVG WAR of a HOF is 59.3

AVG WAR of 2010-2019 BBWAA = 73.2
AVG WAR of 2010-2019 VETS = 49.6
2010-2019 Combined AVG = 68.5

The HOF is actually....watering up? Getting concentrated? People forget that the "watering down" of the HOF started VERY early, so at this point it's actually reversing. We used to get Harold Baines level bad selections from the vets all the time.

[Snapolit1]

It's now the Hall of Very Good and Not Necessarily Amazing. And he belongs there under that umbrella with other Bronx Bombers of similar stature.

[Kenny Cole]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

It's now the Hall of Very Good and Not Necessarily Amazing. And he belongs there under that umbrella with other Bronx Bombers of similar stature.

Its been the Hall of Very Good since 1946.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

Its been the Hall of Very Good since 1946.

When was that first group of marginal 30s players selected? That really set the tone.

[insidethewrapper]

Has CC played for the Yankees ? He has, therefore he will be in the Hall of Fame.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by insidethewrapper

Has CC played for the Yankees ? He has, therefore he will be in the Hall of Fame.

What do people think of Pettitte's chances?

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by insidethewrapper

Has CC played for the Yankees ? He has, therefore he will be in the Hall of Fame.

Surprised Jorge Posada wasn't enshrined. Chris Chambliss and Bernie Williams too.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Surprised Jorge Posada wasn't enshrined. Chris Chambliss and Bernie Williams too.

Willie Randolph. The obvious one, Mattingly.

[Kenny Cole]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

When was that first group of marginal 30s players selected? That really set the tone.

Chesbro, McCarthy, Tinker, Evers and Chance were all inducted in 1946. Maranville in 1954, Schalk in 1955. Flick in 1963, Combs and Haines in 1970.
Bancroft, Hafey, Hooper and Marquard in 1971. Need I go on?

You can make an argument for every one of them. But by and large, they are generally regarded as some of the weaker members. This is not some recent phenomenon. It has been going on for 70+ years.

[packs]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

Chesbro, McCarthy, Tinker, Evers and Chance were all inducted in 1946. Maranville in 1954, Schalk in 1955. Flick in 1963, Combs and Haines in 1970.
Bancroft, Hafey, Hooper and Marquard in 1971. Need I go on?

You can make an argument for every one of them. But by and large, they are generally regarded as some of the weaker members. This is not some recent phenomenon. It has been going on for 70+ years.

Think you're being a little hard on McCarthy. 7 titles and 9 pennants is pretty good.

[Kenny Cole]

Originally Posted by packs

Think you're being a little hard on McCarthy. 7 titles and 9 pennants is pretty good.

Tommy McCarthy, not Joe.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Kenny Cole

Chesbro, McCarthy, Tinker, Evers and Chance were all inducted in 1946. Maranville in 1954, Schalk in 1955. Flick in 1963, Combs and Haines in 1970.
Bancroft, Hafey, Hooper and Marquard in 1971. Need I go on?

You can make an argument for every one of them. But by and large, they are generally regarded as some of the weaker members. This is not some recent phenomenon. It has been going on for 70+ years.

Lloyd Waner and Travis Jackson have to make that list. Ross Youngs.

[xplainer]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

It's now the Hall of Very Good and Not Necessarily Amazing. And he belongs there under that umbrella with other Bronx Bombers of similar stature.

I agree. very good is the mark now.
HOF means little anymore...unless you have their RC in a 10. (Did not mention PSA). Then, you are in like Flint. Yeah, he deserves.

Besides, his cards are produced in the great bulge production numbers. Never will hold a good return.

CC is not a HOFer in my thoughts. My baseball side. Not my card side.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by xplainer

I agree. very good is the mark now.
HOF means little anymore...unless you have their RC in a 10. (Did not mention PSA). Then, you are in like Flint. Yeah, he deserves.

Besides, his cards are produced in the great bulge production numbers. Never will hold a good return.

CC is not a HOFer in my thoughts. My baseball side. Not my card side.

Unless someone's election is a real shock, like Smith and Baines, I agree it won't have a big effect on price. Smith's and Baines' 9s and 10s though went up exponentially when they were elected and still haven't come back to prior levels or even close.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by MVSNYC

I totally agree it's an overall assessment. And as such, CC should get in.

My 250 comment (which others above said the same), is pointing out one (huge) aspect of his game...not the only one for review.

You do have to wonder if we'll ever see another 300 game winner. I don't see anyone active now with a realistic chance. Verlander has 213 and is still phenomenal, but he's 36 so I wouldn't think his chances are great.