Would this kind of grading company interest you?

[marzoumanian]

For decades I was a trade press editor covering the paperboard packaging industry (cardboard boxes and folding cartons) so I'm very aware that paper "breathes (expands and contracts)." Perhaps it will take someone offering a "reward" of, say, $5000 to a computer software wiz to develop that "base" and then test card alternations to see if the software can do its job. If PSA were smart it would develop a way to initially test a card by computer and THEN follow up with the human eye. Just some off-the-cuff ideas. This hobby is still so young but it has to grow and evolve or it will (slowly) die.

[conor912]

What I want to see is a grading company that grades and slabs graded and slabbed cards. I think a card in a slab in a slab would be really spiffy. And slap some f***ing stickers on that thing for good measure. Oh, and LAOs...lots of them....and guranteees.... can't forget the guarantees.

[wondo]

Originally Posted by conor912

What I want to see is a grading company that grades and slabs graded and slabbed cards. I think a card in a slab in a slab would be really spiffy. And slap some f***ing stickers on that thing for good measure. Oh, and LAOs...lots of them....and guranteees.... can't forget the guarantees.

This seems like a ridiculous idea. How would you see the card in between the additional layers?

[conor912]

Originally Posted by wondo

This seems like a ridiculous idea. How would you see the card in between the additional layers?

The LOAs would have photos of the card, duh.

[Sogcollector]

What ever happened to third party grader Alan Hager from the early 1990’s? Based upon what we are seeing now with the PSA grading fiasco, how did Hager’s grading compare to PSA’s? Was it materially better or worse? Why didn’t his grading methodology last? I bought a graded Jordan RC from him in 1993 when I was a kid and recall buying a book he wrote with photographic examples of various grades.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Sogcollector

What ever happened to third party grader Alan Hager from the early 1990’s? Based upon what we are seeing now with the PSA grading fiasco, how did Hager’s grading compare to PSA’s? Was it materially better or worse? Why didn’t his grading methodology last? I bought a graded Jordan RC from him in 1993 when I was a kid and recall buying a book he wrote with photographic examples of various grades.

[unprintable]

[ValKehl]

Originally Posted by Sogcollector

What ever happened to third party grader Alan Hager from the early 1990’s? Based upon what we are seeing now with the PSA grading fiasco, how did Hager’s grading compare to PSA’s? Was it materially better or worse? Why didn’t his grading methodology last? I bought a graded Jordan RC from him in 1993 when I was a kid and recall buying a book he wrote with photographic examples of various grades.

Have there been problems found with cards graded by Alan Hager?

[conor912]

Originally Posted by ValKehl

Have there been problems found with cards graded by Alan Hager?

Oy. Don't give Moser any ideas.

[wondo]

Originally Posted by Sogcollector

What ever happened to third party grader Alan Hager from the early 1990’s? Based upon what we are seeing now with the PSA grading fiasco, how did Hager’s grading compare to PSA’s? Was it materially better or worse? Why didn’t his grading methodology last? I bought a graded Jordan RC from him in 1993 when I was a kid and recall buying a book he wrote with photographic examples of various grades.

We have now come full circle. Some of you youngin's may not know this, but the original TPG (Alan Hagar's Accugrade) was developed with the specific purpose of slabbing doctored cards and duping the collector into buying his product. It had nothing to do with authentication or grading standards. It was less reliable than PRO! I am not sure that PRO isn't a direct descendant of Accugrade.

[robw]

Someone must have mentioned something like this method before? I’ve always thought there should be a way the TPGs could detect resubmissions with proprietary invisible ink. Wouldn’t help a brand new submission, but would seemingly be a deterrent from resubmission. I thought this is done for some autographs.

Leads to another question...if this method was used on a card, would a collector downgrade the card as being altered or “marked?”

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by wondo

We have now come full circle. Some of you youngin's may not know this, but the original TPG (Alan Hagar's Accugrade) was developed with the specific purpose of slabbing doctored cards and duping the collector into buying his product. It had nothing to do with authentication or grading standards. It was less reliable than PRO! I am not sure that PRO isn't a direct descendant of Accugrade.

Alan did invent the slab, or had a patent on it anyhow, I believe. If anyone can find one of the old Accugrade ads in SCD from the early 1990s it would be amusing to look at.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by conor912

What I want to see is a grading company that grades and slabs graded and slabbed cards. I think a card in a slab in a slab would be really spiffy. And slap some f***ing stickers on that thing for good measure. Oh, and LAOs...lots of them....and guranteees.... can't forget the guarantees.

Lol

[Bigdaddy]

Originally Posted by conor912

What I want to see is a grading company that grades and slabs graded and slabbed cards. I think a card in a slab in a slab would be really spiffy. And slap some f***ing stickers on that thing for good measure. Oh, and LAOs...lots of them....and guranteees.... can't forget the guarantees.

And I want a 3D printer that can print 3D printers.

[conor912]

Originally Posted by Bigdaddy

And I want a 3D printer that can print 3D printers.

C'mon, Tom. We're trying to think outside the box here.

3D printed 3D printers are so 2018.
https://hackaday.com/2018/11/27/the-...ed-3d-printer/

[steve B]

Originally Posted by marzoumanian

For decades I was a trade press editor covering the paperboard packaging industry (cardboard boxes and folding cartons) so I'm very aware that paper "breathes (expands and contracts)." Perhaps it will take someone offering a "reward" of, say, $5000 to a computer software wiz to develop that "base" and then test card alternations to see if the software can do its job. If PSA were smart it would develop a way to initially test a card by computer and THEN follow up with the human eye. Just some off-the-cuff ideas. This hobby is still so young but it has to grow and evolve or it will (slowly) die.

I think that some functions could be automated. Centering would be fairly easy. there's already software for stamps that measures the perforations, and that's more difficult. Plus, the margins on each pair of sides would change the same with temperature/breathing etc, (And it may not be necessary to measure that closely. Those changes will be pretty small.

I think a first step would be scanning every card in for grading, at a decent resolution, and maybe adding the centering info that would be measured by the software. Maybe dimensional info too, a decently air conditioned office isn't a climate controlled metrology lab, but should be close enough for now.

The data about overall size, what sort of cut is factory etc, could be built, I could do a decent job on thickness just from my own collection. I have other more complicated database things I want to do, but I'm not a computer person, so any of them would be pretty difficult for me.
I did a spread sheet with images of as many of the 48/9 leaf variations as I could find, and that took a lot of time. It came out pretty nice though.

[T205 GB]

Originally Posted by steve B

I think a first step would be scanning every card in for grading, at a decent resolution, and maybe adding the centering info that would be measured by the software. Maybe dimensional info too, a decently air conditioned office isn't a climate controlled metrology lab, but should be close enough for now.

Pretty darn close. Lots of transparency is needed

Pete you are also correct. It takes a lot of $$ to make a machine.