Poll: response to recent PWCC revelations

[pokerplyr80]

I doubt many here will agree with my point of view publicly but I have not seen any direct evidence of PWCC's involvement besides the acknowledgment of the relationship with Moser and a few cards supposedly bought using their Ebay ID that were later conserved and resold.

I am bidding in their current auction.

The first time I wanted to sell a few cards but didn't know how to go about it ir even whether or not to use a 3rd party or AH. I did some research on my own, talked to a few members here, and decided to send them to PWCC. I was pleased overall with the results and even pleasantly surprised by a few of them. They have received every card I've consigned since. Except for a couple I didn't want to auction.

Unless some direct evidence comes to light implicating them I don't see that changing in the near future.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Excerpt from a 2008 email from Brent in an exchange about why he was selling cards for Gary.

"I'm not ignorant, and I know what Gary does for a living..."

[pokerplyr80]

I am not convinced that any AH has refused to accept consignments from all known or suspected card doctors in the past. I assume they all have accepted them at one point or another. Perhaps they knew and perhaps they didn't. But in the end I don't think it matters. Ban one name and someone will find a way to submit under another.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I am not convinced that any AH has refused to accept consignments from all known or suspected card doctors in the past. I assume they all have accepted them at one point or another. Perhaps they knew and perhaps they didn't. But in the end I don't think it matters. Ban one name and someone will find a way to submit under another.

None of that has anything to do with your statement about direct evidence about PWCC. You're changing the topic.

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

None of that has anything to do with your statement about direct evidence about PWCC. You're changing the topic.

Both points are relevant. The email you posted proves Brent knew what Moser did for a living. Assuming the email was from him. It doesn't even prove that Moser was submitting under his own name. Not to mention that anyone at pwcc knew of specific cards being altered or that they were directly involved in the alterations and grading as others have alleged.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

Both points are relevant. The email you posted proves Brent knew what Moser did for a living. Assuming the email was from him. It doesn't even prove that Moser was submitting under his own name. Not to mention that anyone at pwcc knew of specific cards being altered or that they were directly involved in the alterations and grading as others have alleged.

Believe what you want out on your limb, I don't care any more.

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Believe what you want out on your limb, I don't care any more.

You may be right, and you may not. I'm just not convinced. I don't think I'm out on a limb as far as you think I am. And I still don't think this will bring down PWCC or PSA. Unless it leads to someone new entering either market and gaining the trust of the hobby.

I could see someone coming out with a better grading method capable of detecting the alterations PSA and bgs have apparently been missing. Maybe then an auction house will be started promising only to sell cards that can be guaranteed unaltered. If enough people buy into it things could change. Perhaps a second grading scale will be developed that takes a card's current state and level of alteration or restoration into consideration.

But however it plays out it will be interesting to see.

[frankbmd]

The bank officer is held up at gunpoint and tells the gunman, “Go ahead and shoot. If you don’t kill me, the next bank robber will. I have no evidence that either gun isn’t loaded.”

[Dpeck100]

I answered yes I would keep buying in their auctions.

PWCC is just an EBAY auction house to me. They have consistently gotten the best cards and if the cards leave them I will go there. I have had nothing but very positive dealings with them and while I mindful of what is happening around me I have no interest in blocking myself from the market.

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Excerpt from a 2008 email from Brent in an exchange about why he was selling cards for Gary.

"I'm not ignorant, and I know what Gary does for a living..."

The scent of Bill Mastro hangs in the air.

[Republicaninmass]

With all the time people spend in court and money on attorneys, you'd think they would know the law a bit better.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Yoda

The scent of Bill Mastro hangs in the air.

You mean, Brent Mastro... The sneakier, new improved version

[Collect Equity]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Excerpt from a 2008 email from Brent in an exchange about why he was selling cards for Gary.

"I'm not ignorant, and I know what Gary does for a living..."

I missed this. Can someone send a source link on it?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Collect Equity

I missed this. Can someone send a source link on it?

It's a private email that I have seen personally. There is no link. There are others like it as well.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I doubt many here will agree with my point of view publicly but I have not seen any direct evidence of PWCC's involvement besides the acknowledgment of the relationship with Moser and a few cards supposedly bought using their Ebay ID that were later conserved and resold.

I am bidding in their current auction.

The first time I wanted to sell a few cards but didn't know how to go about it ir even whether or not to use a 3rd party or AH. I did some research on my own, talked to a few members here, and decided to send them to PWCC. I was pleased overall with the results and even pleasantly surprised by a few of them. They have received every card I've consigned since. Except for a couple I didn't want to auction.

Unless some direct evidence comes to light implicating them I don't see that changing in the near future.

To paraphrase Paul Simon, a man sees what he wants to see and disregards the rest. The willful blindness here is truly astounding. I do hope you haven't been burned in your past dealings and don't get burned in your future ones. Or maybe if your cards are altered you don't care, I don't know. If a decade long relationship with a man who appears to have altered cards to the tune of millions of dollars doesn't do much for you, then nothing will, not even the email I posted, you'll just spin that too. But hell if someone can believe Sandy Hook didn't happen, anything is possible in this crazy world.