1952 Bowman Stan Musial PSA 10 on eBay :o

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by PiratesWS1979

The marks that were supposedly removed are actually common attributes of the ’52 Bowman Musial.
Has anybody ever thought that it may have actually bumped to a “10” and was photoshopped when auctioned?

The buyer was on here so maybe he can shed some more light on this.

Hopefully this is the case and there are far less trimmed/altered cards then thought and is just a “camera trick”.

sorry for the poor images

Zero chance it simply bumped. Those marks, while common, were removed and touched up. Card fibers on the reverse prove they are the same card.

[conor912]

I don't know the OP, though he seems like a good guy and I sincerely hope he gets the restitution he's looking for. That said, it's impossible to convince me that he and his ilk aren't the source of this entire problem. Of course not knowingly, but the happy willingness to spend $22k more on a 10 than a 9 is ultimately what is being taken advantage here. It wouldn't be entirely fair to put this squarely on the guys with deep pockets, as no one deserves to get ripped off, regardless of their financial standing. However, they do have a seat at the table which, like or not, is what money buys you in this country. I just wish enough of them would be willing to take their money off the table to make a difference.

[PiratesWS1979]

Actually, there’s a good chance it bumped to a 10, and was photoshopped for resale and not altered.

Hasn’t anyone ever received a card that wasn’t quite the same as the scan? Even from PWCC?
Of course, doesn’t mean it’s trimmed/altered

Before I grab my pitchfork and torch I’d like to hear from the owner to see if the marks are there.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by PiratesWS1979

Actually, there’s a good chance it bumped to a 10, and was photoshopped for resale and not altered.

Hasn’t anyone ever received a card that wasn’t quite the same as the scan? Even from PWCC?
Of course, doesn’t mean it’s trimmed/altered

Before I grab my pitchfork and torch I’d like to hear from the owner to see if the marks are there.

He has indicated he is attempting to return it. If it was just a bump, don't you think Brent would have told him that? And would have urged him to compare the card in hand with the 9 scan?

[Dpeck100]

If it was an in the holder bump the cert would be the same. Out of the holder re grade for a bump is definitely possible.

[PiratesWS1979]

I he's returning it, that's good enough.

[Steve D]

Regarding the '52 Musial:

Here's a picture of the card from Heritage Auctions (it is from their April 2009 Signature Auction, where it sold for $1,673):



Now, here's the image of the card, apparently from September 2017:



Finally, here's the image of the card as a PSA 10:



So, if it was worked on before PSA graded it a 9, this work was done before April 2009, as that is when it was auctioned as a PSA 9 by Heritage.

Steve

[Bicem]

Originally Posted by conor912

I don't know the OP, though he seems like a good guy and I sincerely hope he gets the restitution he's looking for. That said, it's impossible to convince me that he and his ilk aren't the source of this entire problem. Of course not knowingly, but the happy willingness to spend $22k more on a 10 than a 9 is ultimately what is being taken advantage here. It wouldn't be entirely fair to put this squarely on the guys with deep pockets, as no one deserves to get ripped off, regardless of their financial standing. However, they do have a seat at the table which, like or not, is what money buys you in this country. I just wish enough of them would be willing to take their money off the table to make a difference.

Well said, agreed completely.

[PiratesWS1979]

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Cert Number 08168192 is already registered by another member.

If it is two different cards, PSA really needs to contact the owner, if they haven't already, to see if it's still owned. I'm still holding out hope!!

[steve B]

A slightly better image of the PSA10

https://forums.collectors.com/discus...sa-gem-mint-10

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by PiratesWS1979

Cert Number 08168192 is already registered by another member.

There are a lot of dead cert numbers still clogging up pop reports and set registries. That's one reason I recommended they delete both the before and after certs.

[midwaylandscaping]

PSA needs some heat on their A $$. They are either willfully and blissfully ignorant in their grading to let so many big time, big dollar cards that are fraudulent hop-skip-jump through the grading process -or- they , or more specifically a couple of rogue graders, are complicit in this whole mess.

I'll sign that comment and add contact info if need be as I will stand behind my comment and feelings on the matter and don't give a Sh*t. $25k of fraud on the Musial, that was already a great card!!. That's outrageous and every collector who loves this hobby should be completely furious with this.

David Riley
(843) 631-7436 home
(843) 499-4859 tmobile
2072 N Main Street suite D
summerville , sc 29486

[perezfan]

VERY well said!

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by midwaylandscaping

PSA needs some heat on their A $$. They are either willfully and blissfully ignorant in their grading to let so many big time, big dollar cards that are fraudulent hop-skip-jump through the grading process -or- they , or more specifically a couple of rogue graders, are complicit in this whole mess.

I'll sign that comment and add contact info if need be as I will stand behind my comment and feelings on the matter and don't give a Sh*t. $25k of fraud on the Musial, that was already a great card!!. That's outrageous and every collector who loves this hobby should be completely furious with this.

David Riley
(843) 631-7436 home
(843) 499-4859 tmobile
2072 N Main Street suite D
summerville , sc 29486

I do not see enough evidence to be convinced any fraud was committed in this case. Definitive statements like this are not fair to the owner of this card, or to the owners of some of the other cards in question. It may turn out this card was altered and it might not. But just as in more serious real life situations a false allegation can do more damage than can be fixed if it's later determined there was no evidence to support the charge.

Imagine if you spent a few thousand, or tens of thousands on one of the cards listed on these threads and it turns out nothing was done to the card. How difficult do you think it will be to sell it down the road?