How do you think it all shakes out

oldjudge · #1 06-06-2019, 01:10 PM

At Long Beach Show. This has really affected PSA's business--not. Mile long line.

bounce · #2 06-06-2019, 01:48 PM

You forgot to include Beckett in your list...

TPGs - Not entirely sure on this one, as we definitely don't have all the facts and it may take law enforcement to get to a lot of it. I do think PSA ends up buying some cards, most likely the trimmed stuff assuming people can find the pictures. The cleaning and stain removing I think probably slides by, and/or they just fight it the whole way. I don't imagine they just offer it up, but quite honestly that would be the best way to get it over with. Beckett appears to have a different set of issues, and that all still feels like early days to me. Since they don't have the guarantee, I have no idea what happens there. Regardless, I think all TPGs get much stricter in the short run unless it's clear there is no downside, in which case any guarantees will be done and graded cards will just become what autographs already are - just an opinion (and yes, I know some people already view that as what cards are now).

PWCC - I doubt they survive this, unless law enforcement really doesn't get involved. They've had so many missteps to this point. I really think if they want to maintain any relationship with the TPGs, they're going to have to eat most of the refunds, including the cleaning/stain removal that might not actually be altering. I just don't know how long they can weather that financially. And unless they're going to come out publicly and try to do that, there is no way it's just business as usual for them in Chicago. That will become a multi-time daily show, there's no way they'll be able to do business. Add to this the press on this is just starting, so if it's not somewhat resolved by the time we hit Chicago, you just KNOW there are going to be reporters from anywhere close coming through and trying to get their "scoop" on it - what a mess?!?! Unless it's true that "all press is good press".

Moser - Seems to me unless PWCC/PSA is going to insist on charging him with fraud, I'm not sure anything happens to him. If they were going to do that, wouldn't it have already happened? His reputation seems pretty well known already, but that's kinda the beauty of the internet from a privacy standpoint. I think if PWCC figures out they aren't going to be able to survive, then they will try to go after him and take their chances. Without that, I just don't know what would otherwise happen to him.

VCP/Net54 and other advertisers - I think it's a small blip for them, someone else will look to step in any space created and they'll get the advertising dollars back from someone else, or just carry on without it.

The rest - I think there are a lot of people nervous and undecided on what's next. I definitely believe that some people at the margins may just cease collecting and get out. I know for myself, I collect tons of stuff and had stopped collecting cards for more than 15 years before I started up again. I could always just go to something else.

Unless there is a pretty clear response before Chicago, I think the National probably does not go well. Without some substantive resolution of some sort, all the non-message board people are going to get their first taste of this at the show. How do you think they react? For people who do already know, anything more than a couple hundred bucks gets extra scrutiny and if prices aren't lower to reflect the perception of added risk with graded cards, I just don't think they sell as well.

Peter_Spaeth · #3 06-06-2019, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldjudge

At Long Beach Show. This has really affected PSA's business--not. Mile long line.

Are they serving kool aid Jay?

I hear PWCC skipped the show.

ALBB · #4 06-06-2019, 01:54 PM

nothing will change..as time goes on..collectors will keep doing what they do, buy cards..look for deals, look for steals, look for angles...

taul166 · #5 06-06-2019, 02:00 PM

Maybe I missed it, but has Joe Orlando been totally silent lately. I have nothing against Joe, who I have never met in person. But, he strikes me as someone who likes to stay on the stage. I realize he is a collector himself and has a lot of enthusiasm for the hobby, but even after Steve Sloan took his position after Joe was promoted, Joe struck me as someone who stayed on the PSA stage too long and overshadowed Steve as his replacement at PSA.

Peter_Spaeth · #6 06-06-2019, 02:03 PM

Hard to read much into one day of trading, especially with a thinly traded stock, but CLCT did drop 7 percent or so following the Seeking Alpha article. I wonder how that is playing.

taul166 · #7 06-06-2019, 02:03 PM

Should be a very interesting National show in Chicago....which is not far away....the body language of some, who shows and doesn't show up at the National, how they interact with attendees and dealers, etc., etc. could be priceless.

bounce · #8 06-06-2019, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALBB

nothing will change..as time goes on..collectors will keep doing what they do, buy cards..look for deals, look for steals, look for angles...

Steal, create some angles

JollyElm · #9 06-06-2019, 02:17 PM

In virtually all of my ebay searches, I always add (-pwcc, dean) to omit the listings of those two scourges, but when I allow PWCC to show?? A thousand different auctions appear (no matter what I search for) and they all have many bids already logged in. Doesn't seem like the majority of collectors give a crap (yet?) about what's going on.

oldjudge · #10 06-06-2019, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Are they serving kool aid Jay?

I hear PWCC skipped the show.

I waited in line 2 hours and 15 minutes to drop off some WNBA cards. I have always come at the same time on the same day in the past and I never waited more than 15 minutes. They don’t serve kool aid, but they do have a bowl of chocolates.

calvindog · #11 06-06-2019, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldjudge

I waited in line 2 hours and 15 minutes to drop off some WNBA cards. I have always come at the same time on the same day in the past and I never waited more than 15 minutes. They don’t serve kool aid, but they do have a bowl of chocolates.

What’s an Alana Beard rookie worth?

oldjudge · #12 06-06-2019, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calvindog

What’s an Alana Beard rookie worth?

$75 for a PSA10. Did you know her at Duke?

calvindog · #13 06-07-2019, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldjudge

$75 for a PSA10. Did you know her at Duke?

I didn’t. But I watched most of her games. Duke had some great teams back then with Coach G in charge.

Exhibitman · #14 06-06-2019, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldjudge

I waited in line 2 hours and 15 minutes to drop off some WNBA cards.

"WNBA"? What is "WNBA"?

Peter_Spaeth · #15 06-06-2019, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

"WNBA"? What is "WNBA"?

I know you're goofing on Jay but if you watch some games some of these women are fantastic basketball players and because they mostly don't dunk it's more basic, fundamental basketball which purists will appreciate.

BengoughingForAwhile · #16 06-06-2019, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I know you're goofing on Jay but if you watch some games some of these women are fantastic basketball players and because they mostly don't dunk it's more basic, fundamental basketball which purists will appreciate.

They play with a smaller basketball than the men. Ball goes through the hoop easier.

Fuddjcal · #17 06-07-2019, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I know you're goofing on Jay but if you watch some games some of these women are fantastic basketball players and because they mostly don't dunk it's more basic, fundamental basketball which purists will appreciate.

I prefer HS Girls basketball to the Lakers or the Clippers. My friend's daughter is on her way starting with a full scholarship to Santa Clara in her Junior year. They are FUN to watch.