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  #1  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:29 PM
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swarmee swarmee is offline
J0hn Raff3rty
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It's always the cover up that hurts the most. And who asked that those things disappear? eBay per VCP.
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PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
Last edited by swarmee; 06-01-2019 at 07:30 PM.
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  #2  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:35 PM
steve B steve B is offline
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I thought the IDs were back?
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  #3  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:40 PM
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I really don't know much of the details as to what is going on with PWCC, but I read some of the Blowout forum in the link and have an idea.

Does this mean I should suspect trimming or alterations on any PWCC cards I purchased?
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  #4  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by t206madman View Post
I really don't know much of the details as to what is going on with PWCC, but I read some of the Blowout forum in the link and have an idea.

Does this mean I should suspect trimming or alterations on any PWCC cards I purchased?
Most definitely. I know I would. Especially any card with a "High End Sticker". Hell, any card worth over, say $1,000 is quite suspect IMHO.
Last edited by bobbyw8469; 06-01-2019 at 08:01 PM.
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  #5  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:00 PM
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How does PSA determine the amount refund on an improperly graded card? Is it based on current market? Amount paid? Other?

Mark
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  #6  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Mdmtx View Post
How does PSA determine the amount refund on an improperly graded card? Is it based on current market? Amount paid? Other?
Current market per their Grade Guarantee.
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PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
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  #7  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:04 PM
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How does PSA determine the amount refund on an improperly graded card? Is it based on current market? Amount paid? Other?

Mark
Who knows. This is unprecedented. I'm just blown away at the SHEER (or is it SHEAR..haha) MAGNITUDE at the volume of cards that have been tampered with. I would be totally shocked if the Feds don't come in like they did Mastro.
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  #8  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:04 PM
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I wonder if Moser has ever asked for a refund on a rare downgraded card.
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  #9  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:12 PM
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And what a Bull market we are in.
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PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
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  #10  
Old 06-02-2019, 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Mdmtx View Post
How does PSA determine the amount refund on an improperly graded card? Is it based on current market? Amount paid? Other?

Mark
What makes you think that PSA will pay a cent to anyone? That is not their MO; if that was the plan don't you think we'd have heard from PSA by now, nearly a month into this?

I expect that anyone who wants to cash in on the PSA guarantee will have to sue PSA to do it. Smells like a class action to me...
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Last edited by Exhibitman; 06-02-2019 at 07:34 AM.
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  #11  
Old 06-02-2019, 07:37 AM
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What makes you think that PSA will pay a cent to anyone? That is not their MO; if that was the plan don't you think we'd have heard from PSA by now, nearly a month into this?

I expect that anyone who wants to cash in on the PSA guarantee will have to sue PSA to do it. Smells like a class action to me...
On its current trajectory this scandal is going to be the biggest threat they have dealt with yet. We'll see if they do their WIWAG ostrich thing again or provide a more meaningful response.
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  #12  
Old 06-02-2019, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
What makes you think that PSA will pay a cent to anyone? That is not their MO; if that was the plan don't you think we'd have heard from PSA by now, nearly a month into this?

I expect that anyone who wants to cash in on the PSA guarantee will have to sue PSA to do it. Smells like a class action to me...
I suspect they are going to bury their head in the sand like they always have and hope it all just goes away. I can assure you it’s not. This time it’s going to be different.
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  #13  
Old 06-02-2019, 07:46 AM
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I suspect they are going to bury their head in the sand like they always have and hope it all just goes away. I can assure you it’s not. This time it’s going to be different.
Steven, yeah that's certainly been their corporate culture. Will the new guy Sloan make a difference, or the sheer magnitude of it?
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  #14  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:58 PM
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I thought the IDs were back?
They are, but the fact that eBay told Bobby to pull them in the first place was not cool. And it was very likely to have been prodded by PWCC.

I would only worry about the cards bought from PWCC if they're from 1886 to 2019. The rest are probably fine.
__________________
--
PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
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  #15  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:13 PM
Bram99 Bram99 is offline
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Default yes, and...
Quote:
Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
They are, but the fact that eBay told Bobby to pull them in the first place was not cool. And it was very likely to have been prodded by PWCC.

I would only worry about the cards bought from PWCC if they're from 1886 to 2019. The rest are probably fine.
You can also narrow it down to sports and non-sports trading cards.
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  #16  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:17 PM
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At least John gave us the 1886-2019 window.

I see where Topps is now taking orders on the 2037 Baseball Card Set featuring Aaron Judge Jr. RCs.
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  #17  
Old 06-01-2019, 08:28 PM
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At least John gave us the 1886-2019 window.

I see where Topps is now taking orders on the 2037 Baseball Card Set featuring Aaron Judge Jr. RCs.
And the last card of Mike Trout, who made a comeback at age 46 to try once more to make the playoffs for the first time in his career.
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  #18  
Old 06-02-2019, 02:27 PM
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You can also narrow it down to sports and non-sports trading cards.


Coins are probably ok too as they are tougher to trim...
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  #19  
Old 06-02-2019, 03:57 PM
steve B steve B is offline
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Originally Posted by chalupacollects View Post



Coins are probably ok too as they are tougher to trim...
Trim yes, alter.... nope, plenty of altered coins out there. And some of the same arguments apply, like what level of cleaning is ok and what isn't.
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  #20  
Old 06-02-2019, 04:17 PM
jad22 jad22 is offline
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Wouldn't it be easier to figure out all this junk out if Ebay just put the bidder id back without scrambling/masking it?
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  #21  
Old 06-02-2019, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
They are, but the fact that eBay told Bobby to pull them in the first place was not cool. And it was very likely to have been prodded by PWCC.

I would only worry about the cards bought from PWCC if they're from 1886 to 2019. The rest are probably fine.
Anything in a bgs 10 is suspect now too.
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  #22  
Old 06-02-2019, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
It's always the cover up that hurts the most. And who asked that those things disappear? eBay per VCP.
It wasn’t eBay.
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  #23  
Old 06-02-2019, 06:01 AM
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Well, Bobby claims to have proof. And phone records showing many long calls with eBay reps to resolve it. So if it was just Brent and not eBay, that's another company that will take it on the chin.
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PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
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  #24  
Old 06-02-2019, 06:14 AM
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A scandal is occurring that is apparently massive in proportion affecting graded cards at all levels and we're worried about a few hours when some VCP data went dark? WTF.
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Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 06-02-2019 at 06:14 AM.
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  #25  
Old 06-02-2019, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
A scandal is occurring that is apparently massive in proportion affecting graded cards at all levels and we're worried about a few hours when some VCP data went dark? WTF.
Shows Brent was trying to kill the evidence and stop the BO guys from investigating further. And then covering it up by blaming on eBay. Seems pretty bad to me. Aren’t you an attorney?
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  #26  
Old 06-02-2019, 06:39 AM
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Shows Brent was trying to kill the evidence and stop the BO guys from investigating further. And then covering it up by blaming on eBay. Seems pretty bad to me. Aren’t you an attorney?
The evidence against Brent is massive. To me the VCP thing is a sideshow, if that.
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  #27  
Old 06-02-2019, 06:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
The evidence against Brent is massive. To me the VCP thing is a sideshow, if that.
When Brent claims he was duped by Moser and had no clue, he and Bobby are going to have to explain why they removed the links to stop the BO guys from investigating. Bobby presumably is not going to continue lying about this for Brent when he eventually is going to have to explain the story to the Feds, so why would Brent be asking him to do this and then concocting the absurd story of eBay doing it on Memorial Day weekend if he wasn’t aware of the crimes being committed?
Last edited by CuriousGeorge; 06-02-2019 at 07:10 AM. Reason: Clarification
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  #28  
Old 06-02-2019, 06:38 AM
iowadoc77 iowadoc77 is offline
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
A scandal is occurring that is apparently massive in proportion affecting graded cards at all levels and we're worried about a few hours when some VCP data went dark? WTF.
I think people are just trying to put all the pieces together. But I could be wrong.
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